New in town and need some help with my VOS SG!

[Stop Making Sense]

Hi all,

So I'm new to the forum, but not to BK. I've got a pair of PG Blues in my R8 and they rule. However, my main guitar is a newly acquired Custom Shop SG. I need some BRs!

I've ready many a post about what to put in an SG, but I couldn't quite find the answer I'm looking for. (Just a disclaimer, I did use the search function I promise!  :mrgreen:

I play only crusty, vintagey blues. I use old germanium fuzzes (anyone here ever hear of D*A*M??) and like my humbuckers to have low output. For an SG, the tones of Cream are my thing.

Do I want the Riff Raff or is it going to be too bright and too aggressive? I'm leaning heavily towards Stormy Monday even though they are not modeled after the pups that were in early SGs. I play out of a JTM45 clone and keep life simple. I like to be able to hear a nice woody and clear neck pup. Will the Riff Raffs do me well? Thanks in advance!

Cheers,
Aviv

[BigB]

The RR bridge is indeed rather bright and punchy, but not necessarily overly aggressive, depending on your guitar and amp settings - I mean, it can be aggressive enough for these angus young tones and even more, but being very clear it cleans up well too and fattens nicely with the tone pot. 

Kerhonen seems to ge some really nice bluesy tones from a RR bridge / SM neck on this SG, you may want to check his posts in the player section :  http://bareknucklepickups.co.uk/forum/index.php?action=profile;u=3756;sa=showPosts

FWIW, he first had the whole SM set then switched to a RR bridge: http://bareknucklepickups.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=23753.msg314047


As far a I'm concerned I'm very happy with the Mule neck on my own SG. I finally went for something very different (Alnico Nailbomb) on the bridge but I would probably have kept the RR if I was only into blues / classic rock stuff.

[Philly Q]

Welcome aboard!  :D

I can tell from your post you've done your research already.  In fact you probably have a better idea than I do.  But before I got to the end I was already thinking Stormy Mondays rather than Riff Raffs.  Riff Raffs aren't really all that aggressive, but they are bright and "dry".

If you're concerned about the SMs maybe being a bit "soft" sounding, you could consider Alnico IV magnets rather than Alnico II, to tighten up the sound a little.

I don't think you'd go very far wrong with either set though, really.

[Stop Making Sense]

Welcome aboard!  :D

I can tell from your post you've done your research already.  In fact you probably have a better idea than I do.  But before I got to the end I was already thinking Stormy Mondays rather than Riff Raffs.  Riff Raffs aren't really all that aggressive, but they are bright and "dry".

If you're concerned about the SMs maybe being a bit "soft" sounding, you could consider Alnico IV magnets rather than Alnico II, to tighten up the sound a little.

I don't think you'd go very far wrong with either set though, really.

Coolness man! That was going to be my next question: how different are SM IIs versus SM IVs?

Interesting that you use the word "dry," I think I actually know what you mean. That dry sound can be a bit too much for me, I like the subtleties in tone.

[Philly Q]

Interesting that you use the word "dry," I think I actually know what you mean. That dry sound can be a bit too much for me, I like the subtleties in tone.

Yeah, it's not a bad thing, I'm not saying the Riff Raff lacks subtlety, but "it is what it is".  Drink it now, don't put it in your wine cellar (what am I talking about?  :? )

In practical terms, the Riff Raff has the same number of turns in each coil, whereas the Stormy Monday (and Mule, amongst others) have more of a "stagger" between the coils.  I think this results in the latter pickups sounding a bit more "open", picking up a wider frequency range, whereas the Riff Raff seems more focused.

Coolness man! That was going to be my next question: how different are SM IIs versus SM IVs?

Can't speak from personal experience, but try looking for posts by "Fourth Feline".  He's a jazz player who had both AIV and AII in Stormy Mondays.  Mostly they were used in a hollowbody, but he did have them in an old SG at one stage.

[gordiji]

stormy's are great, at least the neck one(AII), i don't have the bridge.
the neck isn't dull and is actually quite bright to my ears and sounds great dirty or clean, obviously it's a bit flabby
on the bass strings when dirty but sounds so good up the neck it's worth it; it's beatiful clean.

[Stop Making Sense]

stormy's are great, at least the neck one(AII), i don't have the bridge.
the neck isn't dull and is actually quite bright to my ears and sounds great dirty or clean, obviously it's a bit flabby
on the bass strings when dirty but sounds so good up the neck it's worth it; it's beatiful clean.

Cool! I don't mind a bit of flab! I think these are gonna be my choice...

I'm still tempted by Riff Raff's but I don't like the idea of taking the chance and not liking them because of harshness/brightness. I don't play AC DC...

Still wondering though, if Riff Raff's are meant to cover EARLY 60s tones, wouldn't they be good for Cream tone?

[Philly Q]

Still wondering though, if Riff Raff's are meant to cover EARLY 60s tones, wouldn't they be good for Cream tone?

I always thought the Riff Raff was based more on the mid/late '60s T-top pickups, but looking at the product page it does now say it's based on the 1960 PAF.  :?

Just to make things more confusing, BKP do make a more accurate T-top replica, but it's not listed in the catalogue.

Maybe you could mix and match - Riff Raff bridge and Stormy Monday neck?  Best of both worlds.

[Telerocker]

I would look at Mules, not saying the RR and the SM aren't great pickups. Of the three I think Mules can do everything and certainly Cream-tones.

[kevinr]

It is only my opinion, however I find that AV seems to sit better in an all mahogany guitar! so maybe AV Mules?

[Stop Making Sense]

The interesting thing about the mags is that there were different manufacturers back in the day, things weren't that consistent and a II could sound like a V and vice versa. I can see the case for going by the mag, but for me I think it's more overall voicing, winds, etc.

Thanks for all the input guys! I'm going to just put a set of Stormy Monday's in there. I like the A II in general and am into the lowest possible output. Gonna place my order shortly!  :orcass:

[kevinr]

You are most probably right! it may all be in our minds, whatever the Stormies are a great set I have mine in a mid 90s epi Joe Pass and they reall  work well, I was just not sure in an SG, can you lets us know the outcome?

[Stop Making Sense]

Eff yes mang! I'll record some clippage and let you hear for yourself! When the SG goes in for the pup swap she'll also be getting some nice cts audio taper pots and some cheap paper in oil Russian caps to replace the fake ass wanna be bumble bees that Gibson parades as "accurate." ya know, the works, so to speak. I'll check back in when I has teh goods.

[Roobubba]

Good grief! He's got out again! We really must apologise for this...

(wheels Phil back into his wine cellar)

:D

[Philly Q]

 :lol: