Help on new pickups for a Les Paul Classic + Bogner Uberschall

[fohl]

Hi guys,
I got no experience with Bare Knuckles and I am looking for some good advice :)
At first place, sorry for my english! I'm not a native speaker ;)

I would like to replace the standard pickup set in a Gibson Les Paul Classic from 2003. The originals are 496R and 500T ceramics as most of you already know. I am playing through a Bogner Uberschall (the old revision without red channel gain compensation)

The 500T is pretty muddy and uninspiring. While basically playing punk and hardcore, I need the balls and tightness but infact there is not much life in the sound.
I would like to add more transients and receive a sound that is more dependent from my right hand.
Infact I need more dynamics!!! I would like to move in a more classical rock direction without loosing the modern attitude. Also a pickup with a little lower or moderate output than the 500T would be perfect because the gain at the Amp's red channel is *f...ing* incredible :lol: But it would be nice to get some more options at this gain poti.
I hope I will also find a solution to make my volume potis on the guitar more versatile by changing the pickups even as well as the overall sound.

I've already replaced the 300k with 500k cts. Without any desired effect... As I read myself into electronics it's quite clear to me why...noob ;)
The neck has so much low end that it is nearly unuseable and differs to much from the bridge :(


I Love mids and edge without to much aggression. So I guess the CS with scooped mids is not what I am looking for.
The Uberschall sounds a bit too cold and too American. I wish I could add some more British character to my sound.
I took a closer look at the Holy Diver and I like the sound samples pretty much! I think this is what could make me damn happy! But I doubt that it will sound like this in a LP especially together with my Bogner. I also like the nailbomb pretty much btw.
I think taming the bogner a bit means to choose a Alnico5 instead of a ceramic. (?)


I've already read about 15 complete posts on the Les Paul topic in this forum and I think you guys know what you're talking about. I am really looking forward to your opinions and suggestions!
I hope I've found the right words and someone can help me outta this Confusion :)


All the Best

[ericsabbath]

the cold sweat is not bloaty like the 500t, but not really scooped
it has a nice amount of upper mids, and quite punchy bass
the nailbomb has more low and center mids than the cold sweat, but less upper mids

the holy diver is just as amazing, but a whole different animal

I think you would enjoy any model of the contemporary line in a les paul through the uber
even the warpig is quite clear

if you really want to tame the output without losing much edge and mids, try the rebel yell, maybe the emerald

[darkbluemurder]

I would like to add more transients and receive a sound that is more dependent from my right hand.
Infact I need more dynamics!!! I would like to move in a more classical rock direction without loosing the modern attitude. Also a pickup with a little lower or moderate output than the 500T would be perfect because the gain at the Amp's red channel is *f...ing* incredible :lol:

Up to that I was thinking Cold Sweat. But then ...

I Love mids and edge without to much aggression. So I guess the CS with scooped mids is not what I am looking for.
...
I took a closer look at the Holy Diver and I like the sound samples pretty much! I think this is what could make me damn happy! But I doubt that it will sound like this in a LP especially together with my Bogner. I also like the nailbomb pretty much btw.
I think taming the bogner a bit means to choose a Alnico5 instead of a ceramic. (?)

The Holydiver is a rather warm sounding pickup with still considerable output. I have played the Ubershall for only a brief period at the Frankfurt Music Fair in 2003 and found that - like the XTC and the Shiva - is still a rather warm sounding amp so it could be too much. The same would apply to the Crawler. The Nailbomb would not really lower the output from the guitar much. I am thinking the Rebel Yell could work well for what you are trying to achieve.

Cheers Stephan

[richard]

I don't think you could go wrong with RYs. They're killer in my Firebird and I'm sure they would be awesome in your LP.

[fohl]

thank you very much guys for taking time on this issue!

Perhaps I shouldn't have told you about the idea of lowering the output from the pickups in first place.
Just to make this clear: This is not the focus! Everything else I described is definetly more important.
I am telling you this because I am a bit afraid of losing too much fatness.

Hm... I started thinking bout the RYs before but I didn't really got it on my list, right because of the fatness story.

For a second let's just forget about the output thing!
Are you still saying: Rebel Yell?
Bridge AND neck?

the neck isn't that important, I just need a pickup that fits to the one on the bridge. If so it would be a improvement...

The Holydiver is a rather warm sounding pickup with still considerable output... I have played the Ubershall for only a brief period at the Frankfurt Music Fair in 2003 and found that ... is still a rather warm sounding amp so it could be too much.

just never put electro harmonics power tubes in it, like I did... *fail* ;) (JJs!)
What do you mean by "warm"? The Uber has much low end if you like. Well I think it's fairly adjustable! Or are you talking bout lower mids? Hm I guess both =)
If I'd pick the nailbomb (I said I liked it because the samples are really cool :)
I would agree immediately but the Holy???  :?

...the holy diver is just as amazing, but a whole different animal... 

Can you describe what's the big difference?
Do you, like Stephan, also think it could be too warm for the Uber?


this issue, I carried for to long and now I'm trying to get want I wish for  :D
thank you so much again for assistance!
cheers!

[ericsabbath]

...the holy diver is just as amazing, but a whole different animal...  

Can you describe what's the big difference?
Do you, like Stephan, also think it could be too warm for the Uber?

the diver is warm, but fairly aggressive
not a throat ripper like the nailbomb, but it shows some teeth
if you want a modern hard rock tone like new Alice In Chains and Whitesnake, maybe the heaviest Nickelback stuff, then go for it
the Diver is absolutely the best for that stuff

the nailbomb is hotter, more focused and has a much sharper high end
close amount of bass and low mids, less but balanced center mids, a lot less upper mids, despite of what the charts show (lot of treble, not really upper mids)
it's a thick sounding pickup, but not as big and "bumpy" as the heavily middy holy diver
lot more dense and aggressive
the coolest part is that it retains some of the vintage cleanish voicing on the mids (which I usually call "hollow PAF mids"), leaving the aggresion kinda out of this frequency range
the diver, on the other hand, has friendly smooth highs and aggressive 80's mids

[Mr. Air]

I got a Nailbomb bridge in a LP clone and like it a lot. It's defenitely more than a one trick pony and is way more than just a metal pickup. I find it very useable for hard rock, punk and the likes, but as Eric says it's defenitely a aggressive mother. If you want something in the ballpark of a Nailbomb, but with less aggressivenes I think the Rebel Yell would suit you (based on my knowledged from the forums as I haven't played a Rebel Yell).

[Kiichi]

On the RY, which I got in the bridge of a Ibanez S: This is a rock pickup. It is quite trebly, with a tight bass. Cuts through the mix.  The beauty lies in the (upper) mids, there is a certain rawness / chainsawness / pure rockness. This Pu has that certain dirt and grit, not in an agressive metal way, more in a high value rock way (think, of course Billy Idol, but also I get a Paul Gilbert a la http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mHGv5FCS2j8 and other modern-classic rock from it . Striking a powerchord just...well rocks. It can do blues and metal as well, though again, it screams rock to me.

Excuse the overuse of the word rock but that is how I feel^^

[fohl]

Excuse the overuse of the word rock but that is how I feel^^

I appreciate! cause this is how WE feel

oh man.. you guys make me wanting more guitars ;)
but what did I expect? a clear "you gotta pick up these"???
how naive ;)

big thanx to everybody who replied, be sure all of your thoughts went on!
I think I'll take a sleep and a drink and a sleep (and maybe another drink...) and then decide right from the stomache, you know ;)
I'll let you know what I feel when playing the RY, the NB or the HD

big cheers!

[Telerocker]

I would look at VHII's and RY's.

[braintheory]

If you want something in the ballpark of a Nailbomb, but with less aggressivenes I think the Rebel Yell would suit you.

Wouldn't the Rebel be just as aggressive if not more so than the nailbomb.  I haven't played either pick up, but that's what I heard.  Also, based on the descriptions I heard, I would imagine that the rebel yell would be more edgey and biting.

[darkbluemurder]

thank you very much guys for taking time on this issue!

Perhaps I shouldn't have told you about the idea of lowering the output from the pickups in first place.
Just to make this clear: This is not the focus! Everything else I described is definetly more important.
I am telling you this because I am a bit afraid of losing too much fatness.

For a second let's just forget about the output thing!
Are you still saying: Rebel Yell?
Bridge AND neck?

the neck isn't that important, I just need a pickup that fits to the one on the bridge. If so it would be a improvement...

In that case, Alnico Nailbomb set.

[

What do you mean by "warm"? The Uber has much low end if you like. Well I think it's fairly adjustable! Or are you talking bout lower mids? Hm I guess both =)

Yes, both. And my impression was that all Bogners were rather smooth in the high end and had a very singing tone. I must say however that I did not play the Uber loud.

Cheers Stephan

[BigB]

Wouldn't the Rebel be just as aggressive if not more so than the nailbomb. 

I have hard time believing the RY could be *more* aggressive than the NB :lol:

[Alex]

When I replaced the 500T with the Miracle Man it worked perfectly. The MM isn't "scooped", it just doesn't have the upper midrange hump many higher output pickup has (it has a lot of low mids IMO).

I found it had no problems doing an Iron Maiden sound, but granted it is probably more output & power than you are looking for.

[Yellowjacket]

I Love mids and edge without to much aggression. So I guess the CS with scooped mids is not what I am looking for.
The Uberschall sounds a bit too cold and too American. I wish I could add some more British character to my sound.
I took a closer look at the Holy Diver and I like the sound samples pretty much! I think this is what could make me damn happy! But I doubt that it will sound like this in a LP especially together with my Bogner. I also like the nailbomb pretty much btw.
I think taming the bogner a bit means to choose a Alnico5 instead of a ceramic. (?)

Did you email Bare Knuckle for their official recommendation?  That is often the best approach.

I can only talk out of my experience but here are my thoughts.

It is a shame that there is not a modern tone demo of the Rebel Yells because they really handle high gain beautifully well.  I have a set in a Les Paul Standard and it makes my Dual Rectifier growl like crazy.  It definitely has more of that 'classic rock' / Marshall upper mid character to the tone, something which I love. 

The pickups are actually similar to the Burstbucker Pro pickups Gibson Offers but they are
-much MUCH clearer
-neck isn't boomy and the bridge isn't overly thin and bright
-they clean up really well when using the volume knob
-they retain clarity, soul, and complexity even under loads of gain
-The bridge has a complex and growling rhythm tone
-the neck has a chiming clean tone and does low gain stuff well  (turn down the volume pot for classic rock and blues)
-neck works well for high gain solos.
-There is a massive and articulate pick attack which makes it really easy to modulate or colour your lead tones with pick attack.  The lead tone RULES, even with a Dual Rec.

The output is NOT the same as a ceramic though.  They'll do great punk / hardcore tones but you'll most likely have to boost your head to get into modern metal territory.  These MAY be what you want but you might find them a bit weak. 

just my $0.02