Anyone else following the Tabak/Yeates case?

[Twinfan]

I've been sucked in via journalist blow-by-blow accounts of the case on Twitter  :oops:

The summing up is almost finished before the jury retire to consider their verdict.  Based on the evidence I've read, I reckon it's a really tough one to call.  Anyone got any theories?

[Afghan Dave]

If he's not a "pikey" guilt is always hard to establish...

[Twinfan]

:lol:

[MrBump]

Let it go, Dave.  Let it go...

Been following it vaguely...  Just seems pretty tragic.

[Twinfan]

Tabak seems to be holding back info to make his case look better, and has done since his initial police statements.  Without enough evidence to prove murder and intent from the prosecution, which is how I'm seeing it, he'll get the manslaughter charge he's admitted to.

Manslaughter is probably not the truth, but I can't see how murder can be proven without a confession in this case.

[Dmoney]

what do you get for manslaughter these days? 6 years? out in 3? that's what it was last time someone I knew got 'manslaughtered'

[Twinfan]

No mandatory sentence, it's up to the judge.

[Dmoney]

No mandatory sentence, it's up to the judge.

Good to know. will be interesting to see what he gets if he does get manslaughter.

[James C]

Its an interesting case, but no one except Tabak knows what happened
A lot of people I know are quite involved in the case as Jo was in the same year in
School as my brother and his friends.

I get drawn into judging the case based on the mug-shots of Tabak where he looks almost smug

[Philly Q]

I've not been following it at all (not since the hatchet job the papers did on that landlord bloke before Tabak was arrested).

Surprised by what you've said Dave, I got the impression it would be a pretty open-and-shut case.

[Twinfan]

That's what I thought, but he's been very selective in what he's said and some things just don't quite add up.  I think he's trying to make himself look as unfortunate as possible, to show he's not the murdering type.

I'm flicking from one verdict to the next, so I'd hate to be on the jury  :(

[Matt77]

On a simplistic level, he lied to the police and therefore I think he will be found guilty by the jury

[Elliot]

I've not been following it - but I would have thought he would found guilty on the Nedrick/Wollin definition of oblique intent.  Has this come up?

The Nedrick/Woollin direction is:

"The Jury are not entitled to find the necessary intention (to murder) unless they feel sure that death or serious bodily harm was a virtual certainty (barring some unforeseen intervention) as a result of the defendant's actions and that the defendant appreciated that such was the case …The decision is one for the Jury to be reached upon a consideration of all the evidence."

[Twinfan]

Not come up Elliot.  The crux seems to be that Tabak didn't know he was going to kill her, it was an accident.  He was trying to stop her screaming by holding her throat and mouth, and she died.

A strange action to take, rather than just walking away, but could it have been a unfortunate accident?  The length of time he would have had to hold her can't be proven conclusively, so there's doubt...

[Elliot]

Actually, looking at the prosecution speech on 'every second he held her it was one step closer' does seem to me to be setting up the jury for the judge to give a Nedrick direction.  The jury's doubt must be about the issue of intent to kill or cause serious harm and the prosecutors 'every second' speech looks like planting the concept in the jury's mind that Tabak had a growing awareness that death or serious harm would follow as a result of his actions thus manifesting the necessary intent.