Info on Another Forum Stating The Older BKPs are Much Better?

[ericsabbath]

I believe that
I mean... I've been using 3 months old strings now in my gibson les paul custom
newer strings just don't sound the same
I heard all brands are now using new metal alloys that don't resonate through the crystal lettuce structures the same way
just bought an epiphone special (THICK PLYWOOD BODY! YEAAH) with new strings and they don't sound awesome like the great vintage 3 months old strings in my gibson
no mojo :/

[Transcend]

to be honest i have found this to be true to an extent.

But not in a bad way

the miracle man i got in 2005 sounds far better (even in the same guitar) than the two i have bought since then.

The other two however did still soudn great.

That one just had that special something

[metalmaniac93]

Yeah, I know that Tim has other winders and that is expected given the high demand for his pickups.  I was just thrown for a loop when this person mentioned that the older BKP pickups are better due to Tim not winding them and the use of different materials for the new pickups.     I know it is only one persons opinion,  I like my HDs, I have heard the RY in my buddies guitar through my rig and they also rock, and I am waiting for my ESP Horizon NTII so I can put an A-bomb/CS neck in it.    So, I am a BKP fan, but do like and use other pickups.

[MDV]

to be honest i have found this to be true to an extent.

But not in a bad way

the miracle man i got in 2005 sounds far better (even in the same guitar) than the two i have bought since then.

The other two however did still soudn great.

That one just had that special something

I've certainly heard better and worse examples, to my ears, of the same pickup, but a lot of the time the better one has been newer.

[Thrull]

weather this is true or not they still cr@p all over anything else in the market

[MAJ Meadows SF]

So, by the same coin are newer custom guitars poorer in quality, creativity, craftsmanship, and playability than older customs from whatever brand? That may be apples to peanuts but I don't buy this arguement.

There are some better sounding pickups than others, but I've seen both as well: some great older ones, some great newer ones. None of them fail to kickass and do what they were built to do.

[Philly Q]

It would be very interesting to see what Tim has to say about this story.

[FELINEGUITARS]

So, by the same coin are newer custom guitars poorer in quality, creativity, craftsmanship, and playability than older customs from whatever brand? That may be apples to peanuts but I don't buy this arguement.

There are some better sounding pickups than others, but I've seen both as well: some great older ones, some great newer ones. None of them fail to kickass and do what they were built to do.

Great points well made

If I look at my own guitar making - things actually IMPROVE as time goes on
My earlier work is good but over time I learn things that I can apply to my craft that improve the product
Because of my ethos I never look to cut corners , or quality of components - in fact the opposite is true

I know a few of the bigger companies (Gibson and Fender etc during the 70s are notable here) who increased their profits by cost cutting by using cheaper components - and on a big scale saving $0.99 on a component stacks up if you make 250,000 guitars a year, but this is not the case with me and also not with BKP

Tim has turned to having more of his own components specially made to ENSURE quality and being able to get parts made the way he wants them.

Now there have ben a few minor spec changes over the years, as certain pickups  are refined to serve their niche in the range .
And some may have preferred the older spec version whilst others favour the newer.....but it is not a decline in quality

[richard]

I do wonder though - if scatter winding a pickup is an art then some artists are going to be better than others. So, has Tim taught his staff to wind pickups as well as he does himself ? I know others have raised the question of consistency as well. How do you guarantee a scatter wind to be the same every time ?

Don't get me wrong - I have no intention of buying any other pickups.

[PhilKing]

I got my first Bareknuckles in 2004 and I have tried pretty much every pickup since.  Because of my playing style I tend to prefer the Alnico magnets to the ceramics.  The first holydivers I heard were in a left handed Feline Lion at LGS in 2005, and I didn't like them, but I have a new voiced Holydiver that I love.  Tim has revoiced some pickups through the years, but all the changes have been for the better, as he heard them through different amps and in different guitars.

I probably have around 40 sets of BK's, some are not in guitars at the moment,  I have changed some around too, but what I can say is that the newest pickups sound just as great as the old pickups.  I might be one of the few people who has been to the BK workshop and to Tim's house.  He has also been to my house here in the States.  Earlier this year I was there to pick up some pickups and to order some more.  I'd also taken an old JBJ Seymour Duncan for repair.  Tim checked it and realised it needed a coil rewound, and did it for me that afternoon.  

Over a couple of beers that night we were discussing pickups (as you do tend to do with Tim!), and different sounds and I have to say that he is as enthusiastic now as he was when I first spoke with him.  He might not make all the pickups, but the guys who make the rest were all taught by Tim and he still checks things out that they do all the time.  He also still winds a lot of pickups (I also know this because they had a large order they were making and Tim was doing about half the pickups).

I can definitely say that the pickups now are just as good as the old ones.   Also Tim only made some of the pickups from the start.  The other original winder is still with the company.

[Chris Rowberry]

Its true that BKP has grown well over the passed years but the only reason BKP has been so successful is because of Tims dedication to quality and tone. He has invested a lot of time and money into tooling the business so it is able to produce its own materials to keep quality at an all time high. Tim also takes a full hands on approach when it comes to the business, as well as running BKP he still winds as much as he can and keeps involved in every aspect of BKP. He also trains his staff to his personal standards and reguarly checks the quality of the products before they get sent to customers (even though every pickup is checked before it goes out anyway).

I do wonder though - if scatter winding a pickup is an art then some artists are going to be better than others. So, has Tim taught his staff to wind pickups as well as he does himself ? I know others have raised the question of consistency as well. How do you guarantee a scatter wind to be the same every time ?

Don't get me wrong - I have no intention of buying any other pickups.

Scatter winding is exactly that..scattered. There is no specific way or pattern to it. The skill is being able to get the wire on neat enough and with the right amount of tension so not to stretch the wire or wind the coil far to thick. Tim will spend months teaching staff how to wind constantly checking the quality of their work to make sure it is up to his personal standards.

I hope this helps towards any questions you guys have/had.

[Tim]

I'd just like to confirm that I still do 'very' much wind here at BKP - in fact I wind more now than I've ever done due to the ever increasing amount of pickups we make and the fact that in the past year I have employed someone to handle the enormous task of answering phone calls, processing orders, invoicing etc that was soaking up huge parts of my time.
My average working week is in excess of 70 hours, the majority of which I spend winding and making pickups - exactly the same way I always have. To say that I don't and to say that older BKPs are in some way different/better than newer ones is absolute nonsense. For the past 7 years we have made all of our own parts, we buy our wire from the same source, likewise our magnets and I constantly check the quality of what we are supplied to ensure that production remains consistent and true to my original designs. I still use my original winder that I put together almost 10 years ago - nothing has changed at all, I even took the work bench my winder is set into when we moved to Cornwall from Devon 6 years ago!! The rest of the team that wind use the same machines as me and I personally teach them how to wind using my method of scatterwinding and building up the coil, completely by hand - just as I've always done and always will do.

[Roobubba]

Amen.

[FELINEGUITARS]

I'd just like to confirm that I still do 'very' much wind here at BKP - in fact I wind more now than I've ever done due to the ever increasing amount of pickups we make and the fact that in the past year I have employed someone to handle the enormous task of answering phone calls, processing orders, invoicing etc that was soaking up huge parts of my time.

Yes - being in a similar position myself at times I can see that hiring Ben will have made a huge difference and allowed Tim to be back at the bench as much if not more than he would have been in previous years.

[richard]

" Scatter winding is exactly that..scattered. There is no specific way or pattern to it. "

This is what I didn't understand. So does this mean that Tim's scatter winding technique is the same regardless of the pickup being wound ? So, is the scatter wind not a factor in creating more bass, less mids etc i.e. he does not use a different wind to create different tonal emphasis ?