Minimum Booze Pricing

[Matt77]

This is getting silly.
I've no beef with you Dave.
I thought you were assuming a few things when you used the "since you have no problem infringing others human rights" bit.
That bit made me re-read your text from a different perspective, which wasn't how I interpreted it first time round.
Beer anyone?

[Philly Q]

Beer anyone?

A nice glass of Shiraz for me, please.  :)

[Afghan Dave]

I have not got a problem with anyones dog...

The point I was making was that nearly all of our choices/pleasures carry positive and negative externalities which need to be balanced in a cooperative society.

When we turn to the "state" to manage these externalities society is failing and that failure should and can be addressed in better ways to preserve life, liberty & the pursuit of happiness.

There are sufficient laws in place to deal with all of the negative externalities associated with excessive booze such as anti-social behaviour & assault or irresponsible dog ownership.

ENFORCE THESE LAWS - punish the transgressors and let each man make the free choice to do the right thing or pay the legal cost of acting like a tw@t...

Being drunk should not mitigate a mans actions or be used as an excuse... throw the book at me if I act like a sh1t drunk or sober.

[AndyR]

Having been "discriminated" against for some time now (smoker), I've not got a lot of sympathy over this one - in fact, none at all :lol:.

It's all kind of "I told you so..." for me.

I do drink, but I've always regarded alcohol as far more of an issue to people and society than tobacco. (I have NO evidence to back this up, it's just the impression/vibe I've had for years).

When the smoking stuff was coming in, I was thinking "fine, if we're going to get all nanny-state about this, what about alcohol then?"

I don't want nanny/police-state about either. It seems to me that if you put a bunch of rules in place, it removes an individual's responsibility to behave in what otherwise might have been a sensible/considerate manner. If there's an "appropriate rule" in place, it tends to stop us having to think and consider our actions around the area that the rule was intended to "help". We tend to go to the "letter of the law" instead. For some that means stay inside it, for some it means "step over it as far as I can without getting caught".

And then if you don't enforce the rules properly... well, you're fecked! :lol:


Anyway, I want legislation against chewing gum - both the chewing of it, and the irresponsible disposal of it. Oh, and, ugly people, they need to be controlled as well... sterilisation might be an option?

[Roobubba]

Join the queue, Andy, my white paper on telecasters, traffic wardens, middle lane drivers and the abolishment of Mactw@tty is far higher priority.

[Afghan Dave]

Andy, that is spot on what I'm saying.

    "First they came for the communists,
    and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a communist.

    Then they came for the trade unionists,
    and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a trade unionist.

    Then they came for the Jews,
    and I didn't speak out because I wasn't a Jew.

    Then they came for me
    and there was no one left to speak out for me".

[AndyR]

Join the queue, Andy, my white paper on telecasters, traffic wardens, middle lane drivers and the abolishment of Mactw@tty is far higher priority.

:lol:

"Ugly people" is a very broad category, I think you can probably get the last three sorted under that legislation - just make sure you put in an amendment to clarify "sterilisation" well enough to "get the job done properly", I wouldn't contest it.

If you agree to support that, I'll happily support your "make telecaster ownership compulsory" legislation going through first :D

The chewing-gum thing can wait, it's just a minor annoyance (besides, anyone caught chewing gum could easily be prosecuted under "Ugly People", anyway).

Didn't you want something about mashed potato as well? We could probably squeeze that in betwen the cracks?

[dave_mc]

^ ^ +1

^ mashed potato? do you want another famine over here? :lol:

This is getting silly.
I've no beef with you Dave.
I thought you were assuming a few things when you used the "since you have no problem infringing others human rights" bit.
That bit made me re-read your text from a different perspective, which wasn't how I interpreted it first time round.
Beer anyone?

no worries :)

I have not got a problem with anyones dog...

The point I was making was that nearly all of our choices/pleasures carry positive and negative externalities which need to be balanced in a cooperative society.

When we turn to the "state" to manage these externalities society is failing and that failure should and can be addressed in better ways to preserve life, liberty & the pursuit of happiness.

There are sufficient laws in place to deal with all of the negative externalities associated with excessive booze such as anti-social behaviour & assault or irresponsible dog ownership.

ENFORCE THESE LAWS - punish the transgressors and let each man make the free choice to do the right thing or pay the legal cost of acting like a tw@t...

Being drunk should not mitigate a mans actions or be used as an excuse... throw the book at me if I act like a sh1t drunk or sober.

+1- especially the "enforce the laws" bit. I'm a completely lenient liberal type, but it's pretty clear if a law is on the books (probably for a good reason) but isn't enforced, people just ignore it.  heck it wouldn't even have to be that big a punishment- if they started handing out £20 spot fines for people letting their dogs run wild it'd probably stop it :lol:

fwiw i actually have no problems with preventing smoking inside public buildings- because that means i don't have to breathe in the smoke. But I'd go no further than that, and it appears that the ones who wanted that now want to do even more. I'm not on a crusade to ban smoking, I just want smokers not to expect me to breathe in their smoke, if we're in an enclosed space where both of us have equally valid reasons to be there. Which, if you ask me, is fair enough.

[Afghan Dave]

I just want smokers not to expect me to breathe in their smoke, if we're in an enclosed space where both of us have equally valid reasons to be there. Which, if you ask me, is fair enough.

As a smoker, I totally agree with you!

If I open "Smokey Dave's Jazz & Fags Booze Club" though... come in and enjoy the smokey fog of smelly deadly dacadence or be asked to leave should you not like the members only practice of Jazzing and Fagging!  :lol: :lol:

Notice: I said MEMBERS CLUB!

Or...

Make smoking in the UK totally illegal. (though foolish at least that would be logically consistant)

What we have now is stupid. A legal & taxable product that I cannot consume with other users indoors & will soon have to be sold under the counter in plain packs... JeeeZus.

[Matt77]

My dog just got attacked by another dog this lunchtime.
The owner didn't have it on a lead and was sat in a field drinking cheap cider.
A minor incident but the timing made me laugh.

In the heat of the moment I didn't get a close enough look at him, but I suspect he was chewing gum, had some mashed potato in his bag and potentially played Paul McCartney tunes on a telecaster when not drinking in a field.

He was probably a cyclist too.

[Twinfan]

^ :lol:

[Philly Q]

He was probably a cyclist too.

Dirty $%&#er.  Did he make a quick getaway by jumping a red light?


(But oh, for the love of God, let's not start that one again....  :roll: )

[nfe]

What we have now is stupid. A legal & taxable product that I cannot consume with other users indoors & will soon have to be sold under the counter in plain packs... JeeeZus.

Yep. I'm not really bothered about having to go outside to smoke - though me and friends definitely go to the pub VASTLY less since the smoking ban - but it'd be far more sensible to simply allow private businesses to make up their own minds. If lots of people are really bothered market forces would make the entire country no-smoking anyway.

Mostly I'm in a huff that when my Alexandrian society do a version of The Bacchae set in a jazz club I can't smoke cigars on stage :lol:

[Afghan Dave]

Before the smoking ban I used to shout at the radio/TV everytime I'd hear someone say "I don't go to pubs because my hair/clothes stink... I can't wait for the ban"

"You never go to pubs ANYWAY you F**KER!! and you won't go AFTER the ban!"

They stay at home drinking a bottle of wine watching Eastenders and nagging their partner then maybe, just maybe go to a pub twice a year and moan about people smoking outside!

I know way too many dull ass couples who sit at home and drink like fish - bottles of wine - way more than I could ever do.

That is why more than 10 pubs a week more or less are closing down...

SCUM!!!

I love my pubs and you puritan motherf**kers have sh1t all over the herritage of this country for NO f**king good reason.

ARGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! DIE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Matt77]

Sounds like somebody needs a cigarette