Fairly simple question

[ericsabbath]

e-mail Tim directly and ask for a 53mm neck MM to replace a neck trembucker or something
I don't see why they wouldn't make one
don't say you want a custom alnico bridge pup

[Slartibartfarst42]

Good idea  :D

You seem to be the only person who has direct experience of using the neck Miracle Man in the bridge so could you tell me more about what it sounds like, especially in comparison to a Holydiver and A-Pig?

[ericsabbath]

Good idea  :D

You seem to be the only person who has direct experience of using the neck Miracle Man in the bridge so could you tell me more about what it sounds like, especially in comparison to a Holydiver and A-Pig?

there's FELINEGUITARS and slate, I think (never heard of that guy again)
I'm pretty sure other users have tried it too

didn't try them in similar guitars
had the diver in 3 les pauls and a sg
briefly tried the warpigs in a brazilian mahogany 7 string bolt-on ibanez RG and the alnico miracle man in a mahogany set neck cort katana
well... had the alnico miracle man in the neck of a couple les pauls as well, if that matters, and played it in the neck of another cort katana

my impression is that it sounded like a middle ground between the other high output alnico models
sounds quite modern like a nailbomb, fat like a warpig and the top is smooth like the diver
similar amount of compression of the warpig but without that midrange grind
sounds pretty different from the ceramic model, since there's no mid scoop or treble spike on higher strings

FELINE usually compares it to the suhr aldrich, but I can't confirm that
I'd say it's somewhat like a dimarzio tonezone or something, but with the BKP top end clarity and midrange openness

A Miracle Man with an alnico 5 magnet
The neck position MM is just such a beast
I asked Tim babout the Aldrich pickup and that is what he suggested

hey there ,
i have an alnico v MM bridge in a custom made SG .
very even tonal response - not slightly scooped in the mids like the ceramic version .
it also loses that metallic edge in the bottom and the top - also not quite as hot .
i have recordings here of both MM versions (ceramic and alnico) in the bridge of the same guitar , and to my ears the alnico sounds a lot bigger and more organic .
but of course , it depends what sound you're after .
slate
 :D

hi ,
i had all the following in my 67 V -
miracle man ( too scooped )
painkiller ( mid hump )
cold sweat - nice
warpig - nice
miracle man alnico V - very nice

my favorite was the mm aV - very even tonal response and big organic sound .
not as high output as the regular MM or the painkiller though .
i'd say that would be a good choice going from 57 classics .
 :D

[Slartibartfarst42]

The Doug Aldrich tone is godly so that's a good start. His tone does sound very much like a Holydiver but with more power, more compression and fatter. If you could add a bit more articulation than he has, that's exactly what I'm after  :D

[darkbluemurder]

Before I explore this further with them, I'd be very interested to hear from anyone who's tried an alnico Miracle Man in the bridge position to learn more about what it's like. I'd be especially interested in comparisons to a Holydiver and A-Pig.

I afraid I cannot help on this one but just in case I missed it: have you tried the Holydiver in the PRS bridge spot to be sure it is what you want there?

Cheers Stephan

[Slartibartfarst42]

I emailed Tim about the alnico MM and he said:

'I wouldn't recommend using the MM neck pickup in the bridge position - it's a suggestion that has been put to me in the past but not one I make myself as I don't find it satisfactory. It really needs a ceramic magnet to drive the bottom end sufficiently in the bridge position otherwise the bass lacks any real drive.'

I guess it's down to the A-Pig or leave the Holydiver there. I haven't tried the HD in the PRS yet but I have no doubt it will be good, though I'm having the cover removed to give it a bit more cut in the mahogany. I'll wait and see what CanadianMetalhead has to say when he's tried the Holydiver so he can compare it to the A-Pig properly but if I do end up leaving the HD in the Jackson, I'll revert to my original idea of putting a set of Abraxas pups in the PRS instead. Can't lose really  :D

[ericsabbath]

I emailed Tim about the alnico MM and he said:

'I wouldn't recommend using the MM neck pickup in the bridge position - it's a suggestion that has been put to me in the past but not one I make myself as I don't find it satisfactory. It really needs a ceramic magnet to drive the bottom end sufficiently in the bridge position otherwise the bass lacks any real drive.'

I guess it's down to the A-Pig or leave the Holydiver there. I haven't tried the HD in the PRS yet but I have no doubt it will be good, though I'm having the cover removed to give it a bit more cut in the mahogany. I'll wait and see what CanadianMetalhead has to say when he's tried the Holydiver so he can compare it to the A-Pig properly but if I do end up leaving the HD in the Jackson, I'll revert to my original idea of putting a set of Abraxas pups in the PRS instead. Can't lose really  :D

well it "drives" the bass harder than the diver
but, it is a cleaner type of saturation than the ceramic MM for sure
I'll replace the neck cold sweat in my greco les paul bridge position with a black dog I have laying around and then I might borrow my bandmates alnico miracle man and give it a try in this guitar as well
not sure if I want that amount of compression, but it certainly matches the guitar tone (it's a quite bright les paul, compared to my 70's gibson custom)

[darkbluemurder]

I'll replace the neck cold sweat in my greco les paul bridge position with a black dog I have laying around and then I might borrow my bandmates alnico miracle man and give it a try in this guitar as well

That will be an interesting comparison for sure!

Cheers Stephan

[Slartibartfarst42]

I suspect I may have my terminology wrong again  :?. I'm talking about 'compression' because when I use my compressor pedal it seems to create a thicker and more fluid tone but reading various posts, I get the impression that compression is not what I'm describing so perhaps the word I'm looking for is 'saturation'. What I think of as a saturated tone seems to cover a range of styles. To me, Tony Iommi has a saturated sound and I love it, providing it retains articulation but I also hear saturation in a lot of what Orianthi does, yet they're vastly different styles. If this is accurate, perhaps it's more accurate to say that what I'm after is a pickup that is similar to a Holydiver but has a bigger and more saturated sound.

[Philly Q]

I suspect I may have my terminology wrong again  :?. I'm talking about 'compression' because when I use my compressor pedal it seems to create a thicker and more fluid tone but reading various posts, I get the impression that compression is not what I'm describing so perhaps the word I'm looking for is 'saturation'.

Confession time:

In all these years I've never really understood what people mean when they say one pickup sounds more "compressed" than another.  :oops:

(Is it the opposite of "open"?)


A compressor pedal evens out the volume of picked notes, "squeezes" the dynamic range of the signal and increases sustain (I always think of the Dan Armstrong Orange Squeezer).  Does that mean a "compressed" sounding pickup smoothes out (or suppresses) picking dynamics?  If so, what physical properties of a pickup would cause that effect?

[ericsabbath]

Does that mean a "compressed" sounding pickup smoothes out (or suppresses) picking dynamics?

yes
just try any dimarzio, gibson or duncan wound over 10k  :lol:

[Slartibartfarst42]

Tim explained it to me as 'compression tends to make things sound smaller and more focused', which seems to me is exactly what the Holydiver isn't. On that basis I imagine the Warpig can't be too compressed either but tighter pickups like Painkiller, Aftermath etc. must have a lot of compression. As ceramic pickups seem to be generally tighter than alnico powered pickups, I'm guessing that ceramic pups are naturally more compressed than alnico versions. I'm guessing of course so someone else may easily tell me I'm wrong and I'm still left confused as to why 'compression' in a pickup makes it sound 'smaller and more focused' while a compression pedal seems to have the opposite effect for me.

All very confusing  :? Either way, I'm still looking for a bridge pickup that is like a Holydiver but with a bigger and more saturated sound. Anyone help? Is it still a Warpig and if so, is it still the alnico version?

[Philly Q]

Does that mean a "compressed" sounding pickup smoothes out (or suppresses) picking dynamics?

yes
just try any dimarzio, gibson or duncan wound over 10k  :lol:

So presumably "compression defeating" factors would be:

Lower output/DC resistance
Asymmetrically wound coils
Scatterwinding

Based on that, I think a "compressed" sound can be fun sometimes, but on the whole I much prefer an "open", more dynamic sound.

Sorry for the hijack!  :oops:

[ericsabbath]

I remember some russian guy posted a comparison between the duncan JB and the alnico warpig in the same guitar on harmony central a couple years ago
let me see if I can find the thread

edit:

JB http://www.soundclick.com/bands/page_songInfo.cfm?bandID=935576&songID=7764506
WP http://www.soundclick.com/bands/page_songInfo.cfm?bandID=935576&songID=7764508

[CanadianMetalhead]

Tim explained it to me as 'compression tends to make things sound smaller and more focused', which seems to me is exactly what the Holydiver isn't. On that basis I imagine the Warpig can't be too compressed either but tighter pickups like Painkiller, Aftermath etc. must have a lot of compression. As ceramic pickups seem to be generally tighter than alnico powered pickups, I'm guessing that ceramic pups are naturally more compressed than alnico versions. I'm guessing of course so someone else may easily tell me I'm wrong and I'm still left confused as to why 'compression' in a pickup makes it sound 'smaller and more focused' while a compression pedal seems to have the opposite effect for me.

All very confusing  :? Either way, I'm still looking for a bridge pickup that is like a Holydiver but with a bigger and more saturated sound. Anyone help? Is it still a Warpig and if so, is it still the alnico version?

Yep that's the alnico warpig