Newbie needs help choosing between Apache and PAT Pend '59 Slab Board set

[GH Lawrence]

G'day. I'm another newbie looking for opinions on a project.

I've "inherited" a Warmoth SC neck and body - one piece maple neck, alder body. I'm getting them from a good friend who's gone in a different direction with his latest SC project.

I'll want a vintage SC sound and am trying to decide between these two pups:

1) Apache
   * listening to the slow blues clip on the BK web site brings a smile to my face - LOVE it!

2) PAT Pend '59 slab board set
   * I love that clean surf sound!
   * I really like the uptempo blues sound

For blues, I give the nod to the Apaches (slightly). I think it may be the fuller quality (more mids, slightly more bass). But the surf sound of the '59 slab board set is really pulling me in that direction.

A couple of other things about my new rig:

1) Amp - I'm building a 5 watt class A SET for this (the AX84 project's P1). I may experiment with a class AB somewhere down the road as well.
2) Just for reference, my "favorite" SC sounds. I'm not trying to copy but want to be able to get something similar in my tone.
Clean sounds I like - Mark Knopfler, David Gilmour
Heavier sounds I like - Robin Trouwer's 'Bridge of Sighs' (most Robin Trower stuff...), the solo from I Mother Earth's song 'The Universe in You'
3) I'm a Luddite and don't like using pedals or effects. I prefer to crank the gain to get distortion. I may need to play around with a uni-vibe though.

Interested in your comments.
a) Can I get that surf sound from the the Apaches?
b) Is either combo "better" than the other given the woods in my neck/body? Perhaps I need to go a different route?

I'll be playing mostly blues and blues/rock.

FWIW, my next project will be a Warmoth LP - already thinking do I go with a P90 or the PG Blue humbuckers but that's still 6 months out at least...

Thanks!

[Andrew W]

I don't have, nor have I tried the '59 set but my Strat has had Apaches in it for about 6 years and I play a lot of Trower-ish, bluesy stuff with it. I would also say that with a set of 11s you can get surfy tones too. The Apaches are my favourite Strat pickups and handle more than you might imagine given their name.

[GH Lawrence]

... I would also say that with a set of 11s you can get surfy tones too...

Thanks Andrew.

Forgive another newb question please, but what are "11's"? I assume you mean Apaches? Thanks again.

Greg

[metale]

Thanks Andrew.

Forgive another newb question please, but what are "11's"? I assume you mean Apaches? Thanks again.

Greg

Andrew means a set of strings starting with an 0.11 gauge on the thinner string. 11-48 I belive?

[Andrew W]

Yes, 11 gauge strings give you a purer, more muscular tone, perfect for surfy shenanigans. Robin Trower uses pretty beefy strings too so they'd help getting that sound also.

[Mr. Air]

I haven't played the 59 slab board set, but there's a good jazzy clean clip of it in the players section.

https://bareknucklepickups.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=27954.0

I got Apaches in a strat with a rosewood board and they're really great even though they're normally adviced for maple boarded strats. As Andrew W says the Apaches can handle more than one style.

[GH Lawrence]

Thanks alot for the clarifications and string tips guys! And for the link to the clip as well - those pups sound sweet and that is some nice playing!

Greg

[PhilKing]

I have both sets, though the Apaches are in a real 57 maple neck strat and the 59 Slab Boards (originally called the 62 Custom set), are in an ash bodied strat with a Warmoth custom Wenge & Bloodwood neck, so the guitars have a very different sound.  I would personally go for the Apaches, given the stuff you like and the fact you have a maple neck.  The 59's are a fatter, more SRV tone and I don't really think they'll get you the Knofler tone, whereas Apaches will.

[GH Lawrence]

Thanks for the feedback PhilKing.

Based on these responses I'm tilting back to the Apaches with 11's.

I've sent an email to Sensei Tim also to see what the bk folks have to say.

Thanks again guys.

Greg

[38thBeatle]

Rather belatedly I too will endorse Apaches. Mine are in a 1970's Strat with a r/w board.They are superb and give you the lovely warm classic Strat tones. I cannot comment on the  '59's as I have never tried a set. I have had my Apaches for around 6 or 7 years too and since installing them I have never wanted to try anything else. I do have another guitar with Slowhands in them and I love them too but in a different way- they have a little more mids to them and are slightly hotter. 

[AndyR]

Another endorsement for Apaches (and 11s!) here.

I haven't tried the 59 set either, but I do have ITs, which I kind of imagine aren't a lot different if the 59 set is what was called the "62 Custom Set" while they were being developed. For what you describe, I'd back the Apaches over ITs.

[djl]

HIya

I've played ITs, Apaches and currently own 59s and 63s

The Apaches and 59s are not all that far away from each other actually. The 59s, to my ears, are very authentic repros of the classic SRV type strat sound, and are the ones I went for after some discussion with Tim. (You've listened to my clips, but they actually distort really well and nail SRV with a tubescreamer). The Apaches have a slightly sweeter edge. I liked them a lot but felt they got a tiny bit too middy for my liking when pushed, but the 59s kept their edge. (IMHO)

63s are great too. Personally I wouldn't go for ITs for what you describe, I think they're better for players who play with distortion most of the time. Others on here will probably disagree!

Anyway, either Apaches or 59s would fit the bill. 59s if you play with a hard hitting style and like to maintain the cutting sound with gain, Apaches if you want something a bit sweeter.

[AndyR]

Personally I wouldn't go for ITs for what you describe, I think they're better for players who play with distortion most of the time. Others on here will probably disagree!

Actually, no disagreement from me!

My IT'd strat does clean quite nicely - so no problem if that was all someone had. And it kinda depends on the cleans you're after, I suppose.

BUT, compared to Apaches (and Sultans, my other set), the clean IT is a little, I don't know, "dry". It doesn't have the "juicyness" that Apaches and Sultans seem to give me.

I have to admit, though, my clean is never squeaky clean - there's always a little "hair". Like the OP, I'm a "straight into the amp" guy. Then I use the guitar controls to clean-up.

But, like you say, I use my IT'd guitar in situations where the amp gain is going to be in the 7-8 region. The Apaches and Sultans handle that (and give better Robin Trower, btw), but they're the ones that excel when I want the amp gain set at 5-6.

In the 6-7 region (where teles and humbuckers usually get plugged in for me), all bets are off on strats - I'll use whichever one has the newer strings!! :lol: (or whose neck I fancy playing at the time).

[GH Lawrence]

This is great feedback guys. It's especially valuable to hear your own experiences with each set. I'm still leaning to the Apaches but glad to know the experts feel the same way I do regarding their sound ;-)
Thanks again.

Greg

[djl]

Hi Greg
I've put a couple more clips in the players section of the 59s and 63s - see what you think