inter-string vibrations - wraparounds and tele saddles

[gwEm]

I've always thought the interstring vibration being somehow enhanced and improving the sound with LP/SG junior style wraparounds and on 3 saddle telecaster bridges was a load of old tosh.

Now I'm not so sure. My current two favourite guitars have these bridge arrangements, and I'm starting to think there might be a bit of energy transfer going on.

What do people think? Real mojo, or crystal lattice?

[Philly Q]

I don't know about inter-string vibrations, but as you know I love wraparound bridges.

They're simple (always a good thing), they feel comfortable under the hand and they sound good!

It is definitely real mojo, not crystal lattice.  Intuitively, it just seems to make sense that the fewer loose parts there are, the less string energy will be "wasted".

[Frank]

All I know is I recently got rid of my Gotoh 6-way tele bridge and replaced it with a 3-way Wilkinson and the difference is just incredible. £50 Gotoh killed all the tone and resonance of the guitar, £20 Wilkinson made it sing and snarl and twang and all those other verbs that we look for in a telecaster.

[gwEm]

I don't know about inter-string vibrations, but as you know I love wraparound bridges.

They're simple (always a good thing), they feel comfortable under the hand and they sound good!

Perhaps it is the simplicity that subjectively improves the tone - less saddles and springs vibrating around.

[Philly Q]

I think with the Tele bridge, the "classic" Tele tone is more to do with the thin magnetic bent-steel baseplate than the type of saddles, although obviously they affect the tone too.

I think it's interesting that boutique Tele parts manufacturers differ on the question of whether the saddles should touch each other.

Callaham:

The current Fender saddles and some of the other aftermarket saddles touch each other firmly. They even make a big deal about it. They are greatly mistaken and flawed in their thinking. Sympathetic vibrations from one string can now influence the vibrations of another string causing dissonant overtones to occur that will drive you crazy, especially at high volume. It is this type of vibration that occurs on acoustic guitars, with their single saddle, that causes beat tones when certain chords are played and phasing problems on other chords. We purposely try to avoid firm large contact between our saddles for this reason.

Glendale:

I carefully thought out and designed what I truly believe will soon become the world's most popular saddles. They are designed so that the ends of the saddles touch. I chose to make them this way because it minimizes movement and helps with the overall sound. It took a lot of time, effort and looking at things in a new way to come up with this design. The E/A is even longer on the E string side, for more string clearance. The edges are designed to touch at the top and not at the bottom. This is a huge improvement. This new relief will allow you to follow the radius of your guitar neck without causing the saddles to separate.

[Frank]

I love how manufacturers of "boutique" hardware will fight to the death over pseudoscience.

[Lucifuge]

I've also seen similar arguments regarding the material of the bridge plate, with one manufacturer claiming theirs was 'authentic' because it used the same thin steel plate while another saying theirs sounded better than the old ones because it used non-magnetic stainless steel.

[Philly Q]

I've also seen similar arguments regarding the material of the bridge plate, with one manufacturer claiming theirs was 'authentic' because it used the same thin steel plate while another saying theirs sounded better than the old ones because it used non-magnetic stainless steel.

Yeah, Glendale makes both a vintage cold rolled steel plate and a stainless version, so you can choose what you like.  In both cases he says "The plate thickness is true to vintage .048, which is a major key in tone. If you make the plate too thick you will lose twang, harmonics and tone."

Callaham uses a slightly thicker cold rolled steel plate which gives a warmer, fatter sound with more sustain.  It's not strictly vintage but he says "I am not interested in reproducing the mistakes and flaws of the past."  He's not keen on stainless: "Using stainless steel would eliminate plating and requires only buffing but the sound is way too bright and thin making it unacceptable."

[38thBeatle]

All that fussin' and a fightin'- they should just be friends.

[Philly Q]

To be fair, it's me (in my OCD way) making a fuss about it, I'm not aware of Glendale or Callaham slagging off each others' products.  They just have different philosophies.

Personally, I've bought parts from both and I think they're both absolutely excellent.  I wouldn't want to say one's "right" or one's "wrong".  It's nice to have a choice and long may they prosper!

[Frank]

This is a trend with some manufacturers though - invent a "problem" that no one's noticed before then invent an expensive "solution" to the "problem". Then charge people £50 to "fix" the "problem".

I'm doing that quotes thing with my fingers in the air, can you tell?

[dave_mc]

afghan dave might be the best person to ask about wraparounds and vibrations? :?

EDIT: ^ yeah, invent a problem and sell you a solution... which isn't to say of course that it definitely is all BS, either, but it's worth being sceptical at the same time.

[Philly Q]

I'm doing that quotes thing with my fingers in the air, can you tell?

Me too.

[bucketshred]

One of the best sounding guitar I've ever played had a wrap around and it was an orgasmic tone! Japanese LP Jr with a BKP P9 btw.

Personally, I find that top wrapping my Gibson Stop Bar/Tuno set up results in a stiffer string feel but also a bigger tone on all my guitars, definatly a better transfer of energy all-round in my experience.

Paddy

[38thBeatle]

I put new strings on my 339 the other night and toyed with trying the wrap around method but in the end opted for the "normal" method on the grounds of aesthetics. As Mrs 38th has, rather cruelly pointed out in the past, if I were worried about aesthetics, I oughtn't to leave the house without some form of disguise.