Arrived at the point where I started thinking about speakers...

[GuitarIv]

Cheers guys, I'll just copy and paste what I have written in another thread:

"As far as the Amp and Cab goes, that's certainly true. Not so long ago my Valveking got back from the technician after a valve blew up, he swapped them out for new ones (6l6s) and what I have perceived is a change in sound which is rather... annoying. Sure, the Amp sounds "better" now that it has new valves, but at the same time it has become so sizzling in sound with way too much highs and a lack of low end that playing anything other than my Jackson Fusion with it is horrible. I have the feeling that either the old tubes, being quite worn (I'm the 3rd owner of the thing and it never had a tube swap before) had a warmer and softer sound to them or the new ones are really cheap. Then again the Cab (Laney GS412la, Tonni Iommi signature) has Celestion 70 eighties in it which are said to be sizzling in sound. The Jackson actually is naturally a darker guitar and the Painkiller sounds perfectly balanced in it, however I still need to be carefull with the treble and the presence. My Strat which is on the very bright side sounds horrible through it. The Holydiver has no bottom end and almost a single coil like quality to it, however playing through my Orange Micro Terror with it the Strat sounds fine and I have to dial in a brighter sound for the Jackson..."

So as you see my current problem with my setup is my speakers are waaay to spikey sounding. I've done some research and listened to clips and what a wonder, I found I like the sound of Celestion Vintage 30s and G12T75s the most.

Now as far as I know Marshall used either one in their cabs. Can you enlighten me a bit on the differences, the strengths, the weaknesses and if a mixed match in a say 2*12 cab would work? As far as I perceive the V30s have the signature mid range grind and the T75s seem to be more scooped? Help would be appreciated! :)

Cheers

[dave_mc]

^ yeah pretty much.

v30 has an upper mid spike, rolled off top end (so it sorta sounds bright but not bright at the same time, if that makes sense) and cut/tight bass.

g12t75 has top end sizzle/fizz, mid scoop and boomy/loose lows.

they combine pretty well. whether they'd be your absolute favourite mix is another thing, though, a lot of mixes sound good (though a lot sound terrible, too :lol: ).

[GuitarIv]

It isn't the tightest and cleanest but those clips show of the difference and the mix of both speakers pretty well:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kn2UoDJOEAo&list=UUDqTpFPc4Cil6qooxzBlk3A

http://www.youtube.com/watch?annotation_id=annotation_636705&feature=iv&index=1&list=UUDqTpFPc4Cil6qooxzBlk3A&src_vid=Kn2UoDJOEAo&v=9hNeHl998v4

The T75 nails the early 'tallica tone pretty well and the combination seems to compliment each other rather nicely :)

[Toe-Knee]

If you want those kinda v30 tones.

Id recommend the Eminence V128.

Its pretty much like a tighter v30 with less fizz in the highs and its also punchier imho with less grating mids.

After going through loads of speakers i settled on this as my perfect speaker.

It's also about half the price of a v30 too which is nice.

[Telerocker]

WGS Veteran 30: V30-flavour with smoothed out uppermids.

[Brow]

What you're describing is pretty much why I changed valves in my Toe-Knee built SLO Clone for JJ 6L6GCs at his recommendation.

They bought down and rounded out the treble frequencies whilst also adding a little bit more bass. It might be a good thing to try before you go looking at different speakers.

[dave_mc]

yeah the g12t75 is very much classic 80s fizzy metal tones, and the v30 is more modern. those vids aren't too bad in showing the differences.

i like the v128 a lot, in fact it's my favourite speaker with my jet city, but as toe-knee says, it doesn't sound the same as a v30 (i'd have said the v30 was tighter but i could be misremembering, i haven't done any head to heads for a while :lol: ), and if you want something that sounds the same as a v30 i'd just get a v30. Conversely, if you find yourself saying, "I like the v30, but it's a bit strident in the mids" or something like that, the v128 might be worth considering- though it's also worth bearing in mind that the g12t75 will tame the v30 a fair bit, too (and some other speakers mixed with the v30 will, too).

[GuitarIv]

Thanks for all the replies guys! Never actually thought about something else besides Celestion, since those seem to be a popular and delivering solution for most things.

So to sum up: changing the Valves to JJs and maybe getting 2 Eminence V128 speakers (to wire them up in a X-Pattern with the Stock seventy 80s?) should solve the problem? I looked up the prices for the V30s and the 128s seem to be a far cheaper solution. Of course I would need to learn how to change tubes, bias the amp (does the Valveking need Bias adjustment?) and wire the speakers into the cab...

[dave_mc]

It might well be cheaper just to get a better cab which already has good speakers in it. I don't have much experience with 70/80s, but what little i've tried of them I didn't much like them. and swapping 4 speakers gets expensive really, really quickly.

[GuitarIv]

That's why I'd buy only 2 new speakers and wire them into a X-Pattern with the old ones. Before I get myself 4 new speakers, I would certainly rather get a new cab :P

[JJretroTONEGOD]

That's why I'd buy only 2 new speakers and wire them into a X-Pattern with the old ones. Before I get myself 4 new speakers, I would certainly rather get a new cab :P

to honest that is a much more sensible idea, when I went from a harley benton to an orange the orange cab trashed it, it's just as much about the quality of wood and construction and how it resonates than it is about speaker choice. I honestly think that almost any speaker would sound good in it...well maybe not some but most.

[Brow]

Before spending money on 2 speakers or a new cab I really would try some JJ 6L6GCs if your amp can take them.

I was in the same position where I was going to ditch my V30s as they were just far too bright with my Toe-Knee built SLO but the valve change sorted it right out, and saved me alot more money than changing speakers or cab

[JJretroTONEGOD]

Before spending money on 2 speakers or a new cab I really would try some JJ 6L6GCs if your amp can take them.

I was in the same position where I was going to ditch my V30s as they were just far too bright with my Toe-Knee built SLO but the valve change sorted it right out, and saved me alot more money than changing speakers or cab

I agree...it's not expensive to buy a new valve and they make a massive difference as you say. I was also going to ditch my Fender Champion 600 but then got a JJ ECC83 and 6V6 and it sounded amazing compared to the cheap chinese ones, so ended up keeping it.

[dave_mc]

That's why I'd buy only 2 new speakers and wire them into a X-Pattern with the old ones. Before I get myself 4 new speakers, I would certainly rather get a new cab :P

i'd just be concerned that two good speakers combined with two mediocre ones might not sound that great

doing a valve swap is probably worth considering, too

[witeter]

I saw that same youtube vid youve posted when looking into speakers-i used to have G12T75s but then changed to V30s which I love, they seem clearer to my ears. I would like to try an X pattern combo but as I am gonna be downsizing I will probably stick with V30s