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Author Topic: Replacement Pickups for PRS SE Bernie Marsden  (Read 14441 times)

schneidas

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Replacement Pickups for PRS SE Bernie Marsden
« on: August 02, 2013, 07:51:58 AM »
Hey guys,  :D

I'm looking for a set of replacement pickups for my PRS SE Bernie Marsden (LP style singlecut with LP scale and LP-like woods).
The original pickups were quite good actually, although the bridge pickup was kind of one-dimensional sounding to me and I also was not too fond of the zebra look - so a replacement was necessary. The neck pickup however was quite nice and woked well with my style of playing.

The first replacement set I tried were Duncan A2Pros - but they didn't work for me at all. For my style, the neck pickup was completely unusably muddy (don't know how Slash does it) and the bridge was weak and also kind of dark.
Next set was the BKP 10th anniversary set. A great quality set, but to make it short - I now know that I'm just not an A2 guy.

So, after reading countless of posts and reviews here, listening to all audio files etc. I have narrowed it down to these models (or combos):


-Rebel Yells
-VH2's
-Mules
-Crawlers
-Black dog bridge
-Holy diver bridge
-Emerald bridge / Mule neck


The guitar itself is pretty balanced sounding, neither bright nor dark - just quite nice and balanced.

I'm a lead player mostly - switching a lot between neck and bridge but using the neck pickup 90% of soloing time with heavy overdrive.

I'm terrible at describing sounds, but here is what I think I want:

-bridge pickup: big sounding chords, every string clearly audible. Good dose of output (not weak or thin). Warm or balanced but with clear treble (not bright or trebly though).
-neck pickup: juicy attack and good response to fast alternate picking (I do a lot of fast alternate picking runs, but I;m not a metal player - more rock oriented. Think YJM style alternate picking but with more of a Slash sound).
The pickups should also not be "tight". I have tried tight feeling pickups (like a Duncan distortion or Duncan Custom) and I never gotten along with them.

I hope I was not too confusing...
Thank you all for your help in advance,

Chris
Owned past BKP models: VH2 set, Mule set, 10th Anniversary set,  Emerald set

ericsabbath

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Re: Replacement Pickups for PRS SE Bernie Marsden
« Reply #1 on: August 02, 2013, 09:03:14 AM »
why dismissing the riff raffs?
Riff Raff, Mules, Black Dog, VHII's, Cold Sweat

schneidas

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Re: Replacement Pickups for PRS SE Bernie Marsden
« Reply #2 on: August 02, 2013, 10:12:30 AM »
I dunno... I think I remember reading somewhere that they were on the bright side.
I guess that's my main concearn with the riffraffs - the words in the description "bright" and "aggressiveness"  :?
Owned past BKP models: VH2 set, Mule set, 10th Anniversary set,  Emerald set

schneidas

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Re: Replacement Pickups for PRS SE Bernie Marsden
« Reply #3 on: August 02, 2013, 04:12:34 PM »
After emailing Tim with the same question, his recommendation regarding neck pickups (since that is my primary focus) were either the VH2 neck or the Emerald neck, and then go with the matching bridge pickup.

I was about to opt for the Vh2-neck but this review might have me convinced to try an Emerald neck, especially since I'm using a similar guitar (PRS SE 245):
https://bareknucklepickups.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=28425

The neck sounds really impressive from the description. I'm also a fan of early Dave Murray...
However, the reviewer says that the Emerald bridge is *really* bright, which is not what I'm looking for.

What about the following combos? :

Emerald-N / RY bridge
Emerald-N / VH2 bridge
Emerald-N / Abraxas bridge

Any advice greatly appreciated  :D
« Last Edit: August 02, 2013, 04:27:30 PM by schneidas »
Owned past BKP models: VH2 set, Mule set, 10th Anniversary set,  Emerald set

Slartibartfarst42

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Re: Replacement Pickups for PRS SE Bernie Marsden
« Reply #4 on: August 02, 2013, 05:11:28 PM »
Interesting - when I first started to read your post my first thought was that you'd love the Holydiver/Emerald set I use in my PRS and then you went and referenced my review so I beat myself to my own recommendation!

As far as the neck is concerned, I think you'll really like the Emerald. It has the smooth sweetness of an AIV magnet that is offset with a more modern choice of wire than you normally get in PAF style pickups. It really is the perfect neck pickup as far as I'm concerned. That leaves the bridge to contend with and I'm not as sure you'd like the Emerald bridge as it is quite a bit brighter than the neck version.

Three [possible bridge pickups leap to mind:

Holydiver - You'll find my review of this pickup on the site too but essentially it's a versatile pickup that has its natural home in 80's Metal but it will also do Classic Rock well. It is what you might call a 'tight' pickup but it's not extreme like say a Nailbomb or Aftermath etc. Nicely thick and organic with a really sweet lead tone and well articulated.

Abraxas - I've never played on of these myself but it sounds like it will fit the bill perfectly. In many ways it's a perfect match for an Emerald neck as it uses the same AIV magnet and the same 43PE wire but wound hotter than the Emerald bridge so it has less brightness in its tone. Where the Emerald bridge is tight, the Abraxas is smooth.

Crawler - In some ways this is a similar idea to the Abraxas but it's wound hotter so there is even more bass there and the magnet is changed to AV to give it the articulation it might start to lose with such a hot wind. The Crawler has a huge bottom end and has a really 'Rocky' growl to it. Very fat tones going on here and very rich sounding. Again, you'll find my review on the website. I now have two PRS SE Custom 24 guitars and the Crawler bridge is in one of them and will soon be joined by the Emerald neck. I was after a really thick and rich 'Les Paul' type of tone for the Blues Rock tones of players like Gary Moore and Slash and Tim suggested the Crawler so it could well work for you.

If you're more Rock than Metal I'd be inclined to say either Abraxas or Crawler. My Crawler is in the brighter of my two CU24 guitars and it sits well in that one for sure. Instant Les Paul from a CU24. I am sorely tempted to say Crawler as in many ways it's perfect for what you want but I hesitate because it does have a lot of bass and your Bernie Marsden guitar is carrying a hell of a lot of mahogany in it which should make it a little darker than mine. If that is the case, I'd go with the Abraxas as a slightly brighter option. I'm pretty sure it's one of these two you'd like but I've never played a Bernie Marsden so I can't say for sure how it is tonally compared to the CU24.
BKP owned:

Bridge - Emerald; Cold Sweat; Crawler; A-Bomb; Holydiver; Miracle Man; Sinner; Trilogy Suite

Neck - Emerald; Cold Sweat; Crawler; Holydiver; Sinner; Trilogy Suite

ericsabbath

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Re: Replacement Pickups for PRS SE Bernie Marsden
« Reply #5 on: August 02, 2013, 06:04:45 PM »
I dunno... I think I remember reading somewhere that they were on the bright side.

yes, they are
and so are the mules, vhII's, emeralds, rebel yells and the alnico 2 pros  :P
Riff Raff, Mules, Black Dog, VHII's, Cold Sweat

schneidas

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Re: Replacement Pickups for PRS SE Bernie Marsden
« Reply #6 on: August 12, 2013, 08:34:29 AM »
Sorry for getting back this late...

The 10th anniversaries are back on their way to Tim.
Meanwhile, I've done a ton of research for their replacement, listened to every y/t clip possible and also did a more proper comparison of the dry tone of my PRS with my other guitars.

Truth is, I was so used to the tone of the Bernie Marsden, that my ears had adjusted and it sounded pretty balanced to me.
But turns out, the guitar is actually on the bright side and a bit scooped in the middle spectrum when compared side to side with all my other guitars.
It is very resonant indeed, but compared to the others, it has less mids and much more highs.

So, the pickups should work in a relatively bright and relatively scooped PRS SE.


As far as the neck is concerned, I think you'll really like the Emerald. It has the smooth sweetness of an AIV magnet that is offset with a more modern choice of wire than you normally get in PAF style pickups. It really is the perfect neck pickup as far as I'm concerned. That leaves the bridge to contend with and I'm not as sure you'd like the Emerald bridge as it is quite a bit brighter than the neck version.

Although, at first, I was leaning torwards the Mule for the neck, I'm willing to take a bet on the neck Emerald (if you guys still think it will work in a bright LP style).
I'll be honest, the clips on the website didn't excite me that much, but there's gotta be a reason why you guys rave about that particular pickup - so I might as well give it a try.



Holydiver - You'll find my review of this pickup on the site too but essentially it's a versatile pickup that has its natural home in 80's Metal but it will also do Classic Rock well. It is what you might call a 'tight' pickup but it's not extreme like say a Nailbomb or Aftermath etc. Nicely thick and organic with a really sweet lead tone and well articulated.

Abraxas - I've never played on of these myself but it sounds like it will fit the bill perfectly. In many ways it's a perfect match for an Emerald neck as it uses the same AIV magnet and the same 43PE wire but wound hotter than the Emerald bridge so it has less brightness in its tone. Where the Emerald bridge is tight, the Abraxas is smooth.

Crawler - In some ways this is a similar idea to the Abraxas but it's wound hotter so there is even more bass there and the magnet is changed to AV to give it the articulation it might start to lose with such a hot wind. The Crawler has a huge bottom end and has a really 'Rocky' growl to it. Very fat tones going on here and very rich sounding. Again, you'll find my review on the website. I now have two PRS SE Custom 24 guitars and the Crawler bridge is in one of them and will soon be joined by the Emerald neck. I was after a really thick and rich 'Les Paul' type of tone for the Blues Rock tones of players like Gary Moore and Slash and Tim suggested the Crawler so it could well work for you.

Regarding the bridge, the Diver scares me a bit - as it might be too "Metal", while I'm more Blues/Rock oriented.
The Abraxas might be a good possibility, but again, the clips on the website didn't really floor me. Also, they are slightly different to the other clips, as if the guitar was tuned differently or something (or am I hearing things?) - which might explain why I was not too thrilled with them.

The Crawler OTOH sound like it will be too much. Like too warm.

What do you guys think about pairing the Emerald neck to a Black Dog bridge? Or maybe even a Riff Raff bridge?

Thanks again, really appreciate your input!  :D
Owned past BKP models: VH2 set, Mule set, 10th Anniversary set,  Emerald set

GuitarIv

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Re: Replacement Pickups for PRS SE Bernie Marsden
« Reply #7 on: August 12, 2013, 03:08:16 PM »
I will chime in and agree that the Holydiver/Emerald combo would be great (getting myself an Emerald Neck to accompany the Holydiver in my Jackson) and don't worry about the HD being too modern. It certainly can do heavy stuff with a boost but I find it more sitting somewhere in the old school type of sound and you can do blues with ease. The cleans are good and note separation is superb. So HD gets my vote, nice juicy and fat tone that is usable in lots of applications and the leads are just to die for. You can read my review:

https://bareknucklepickups.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=30361.0

Cheers

p.s.: I think a Black Dog would be a good choice for a toned down Holydiver :)
« Last Edit: August 12, 2013, 03:09:54 PM by GuitarIv »

Telerocker

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Re: Replacement Pickups for PRS SE Bernie Marsden
« Reply #8 on: August 12, 2013, 07:17:57 PM »
When it has to be the BD, I would pair that with a Mule-neck. It's superb and would balance good with the BD-bridge.
Mules, VHII, Crawler, MM's, IT's, BG50's.

schneidas

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Re: Replacement Pickups for PRS SE Bernie Marsden
« Reply #9 on: September 20, 2013, 07:10:10 PM »
Ok, this turned out harder than I thought...

I have made some progress here.

Baiscally, I got a VH2 set and an Emerald set from Tim & Ben.

Short review (after 4 days of testing):

Emerald neck: very fat tone. Not bright at all. Nice A4 magnet compression. Good attack. Strings feel as if I've suddenly changed from 10s to 11s - yes, it's that fat!

Emerald bridge: Was expecting this to be bright (even though Tim and Ben said it would not be). Result: Deep, thick tone! Great clarity. But NOT bright. Again, my strings feel as if they got heavier and thicker. (and that is even after I changed to 550k BKP pots and fresh strings). Great punching tone, really hard, driving and THICK (I cannot stress this enough).


Just for kicks, I installed the VH2 set even though it was supposed to be for another guitar.

VH2 bridge: WOW!! Clarity, punchy, great thunk, drive, harmonics - this pickups is exactly what I'm looking for in my Superstrat. Even in the Bernie Marsden - it has great drive, fat but not too thick - this migt be the most prefectly balanced bridge humbucker.

VH2 neck: Good output, vintagey, kinda Alnico2 tone meets Alnico5 attack. Interesting.


To be honest: out of those 4, I'm keeping the VH2 bridge as it nails what I wanted 100%.
The VH2 neck is not exactly what I had in mind.
The Emerald neck is great but just too thick and fat for the Bernie Marsden (yes, I played around with pickup height and adjusted bass, middle, highs and presence on my amp 's EQ). Same goes for the Emerald bridge: just too darn thick.

I think after this, I'm considering a Mule neck and a RiffRaff bridge. What do you reckon?


btw, I made some clips, but it is just mindless wanking, riffing and playing around - just as a future reference for me - with my standard settings - just to get the feel of these if I listen to the clips again in the future (for comparison reasons).
I can upload the clips if you want - maybe it will be helpful to some of you - just let me know.

Anyway, appreciate your input regarding the Mule neck / RiffRaff bridge, or even RiffRaff neck / RiffRaff bridge combo
« Last Edit: September 20, 2013, 07:13:39 PM by schneidas »
Owned past BKP models: VH2 set, Mule set, 10th Anniversary set,  Emerald set

Slartibartfarst42

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Re: Replacement Pickups for PRS SE Bernie Marsden
« Reply #10 on: September 20, 2013, 08:07:18 PM »
Strange how your experience of the Emerald bridge was quite different to mine. I certainly found it thick and with great tone but also rather bright.

The Mule neck is too vintage for me and I've never fancied a Riff Raff but I think Cold Sweats and Rebel Yells might suit you based on what you've just said.
BKP owned:

Bridge - Emerald; Cold Sweat; Crawler; A-Bomb; Holydiver; Miracle Man; Sinner; Trilogy Suite

Neck - Emerald; Cold Sweat; Crawler; Holydiver; Sinner; Trilogy Suite

JimmyMoorby

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Re: Replacement Pickups for PRS SE Bernie Marsden
« Reply #11 on: September 20, 2013, 08:23:23 PM »
The bernie marsden guitar or a bc rich mockingbird are definitely gonna be my next purchase (Hopefully soon) after trying out several guitars ive wanted to recently and id definitely change the pickups too so id be very interested in any clips youd put up.

schneidas

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Re: Replacement Pickups for PRS SE Bernie Marsden
« Reply #12 on: September 20, 2013, 08:58:43 PM »
@JM - no prob - I'll upload them.

Please keep in mind those are just "reference" clips for me with identical settings (my standard rig basically) - and I just play a lot of random, mindless stuff.
Just so the clip captures the "feel" of a pickup set - if I ever wonder in the future what a set sounded like, I come back to these...
Owned past BKP models: VH2 set, Mule set, 10th Anniversary set,  Emerald set

schneidas

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Re: Replacement Pickups for PRS SE Bernie Marsden
« Reply #13 on: September 20, 2013, 09:01:02 PM »
PRS SE Bernie Marsden, 550k BKP volume 550k BKP tone pots, Emerald neck (covered, raw nickel) / Emerald bridge (uncovered, zebra)

« Last Edit: September 20, 2013, 09:03:13 PM by schneidas »
Owned past BKP models: VH2 set, Mule set, 10th Anniversary set,  Emerald set

schneidas

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Re: Replacement Pickups for PRS SE Bernie Marsden
« Reply #14 on: September 20, 2013, 09:02:26 PM »
PRS SE Bernie Marsden, 550k BKP volume 550k BKP tone pots, VH2 neck (uncovered, black) / VH2 bridge (uncovered, black)
Owned past BKP models: VH2 set, Mule set, 10th Anniversary set,  Emerald set