Username: Password:

Author Topic: Suggestions for Mahogany Charvel  (Read 2772 times)

JohannvonDagg

  • Strawweight
  • *
  • Posts: 4
  • BKPs:
Suggestions for Mahogany Charvel
« on: September 15, 2014, 10:53:30 PM »
Hey guys,
I'm new to these forums, but I've been been keen on Bare Knuckle Pickups for some time. I've never had any before, but I'd like to get a set for my Charvel DC-1 ST to replace the EMG 81-85 set I've got in there at the moment.
The most important thing for me is versatility. I'm looking to get both a nice metal tone (think Deliverance or Ghost Reveries era Opeth) as well as some warm, creamy, jazzy clean tones.
My guitar is a neckthrough, whereby both the neck and the body are made of Mahogany. I wouldn't say it's a particularly heavy or thick guitar, though it's certainly not super thin.

I had initially thought about getting a set of alnico Nailbombs, but a friend of mine suggested a Black Dog set because of the higher mid response and lower output.
My question is if you fine people think I'll be able to get the sound I want with the Black Dogs or if you could offer me other suggestions.

Thanks in advance!

Yellowjacket

  • Lightweight
  • ***
  • Posts: 853
Re: Suggestions for Mahogany Charvel
« Reply #1 on: September 15, 2014, 10:56:27 PM »
How does the guitar sound unplugged?  Is it really warm and phat sounding? 

I have a mahogany block of wood with a bolt on mahogany neck and a rosewood board.  Rebel Yell B / VHII N is marvelous in it.  BUt, this is really the domain of R&R.  For metal, you may want to try something else. 

[edit]  If you have a great high gain head, the Rebel Yell Bridge can be easily coaxed into metal territory by way of a boost. 
« Last Edit: September 15, 2014, 11:01:02 PM by Yellowjacket »

JohannvonDagg

  • Strawweight
  • *
  • Posts: 4
  • BKPs:
Re: Suggestions for Mahogany Charvel
« Reply #2 on: September 15, 2014, 11:15:59 PM »
I wouldn't say it's notably phat, but it's certainly not shrill. I'd place it closer to an unplugged Les Paul than a strat, for example.

I know Dez from The Safety Fire uses a Rebel Yell / VHII setup sometimes, and I do love his tone, though I don't know how much of that is a result of his production skills.

Currently my only 'rig' is a Line 6 POD HD500X, as I've been until recently quite transient. That being said, if there's one thing I can get out of my POD, it's a lot of gain!

Telerocker

  • Middleweight
  • *****
  • Posts: 7433
Re: Suggestions for Mahogany Charvel
« Reply #3 on: September 15, 2014, 11:40:30 PM »
Nailbombs are quite agressive and I don't associate them with warm creamy jazzy tones. I think you should inspect the Holy Diver for the bridge and the VHII and Emerald for the neck.
Mules, VHII, Crawler, MM's, IT's, BG50's.

Yellowjacket

  • Lightweight
  • ***
  • Posts: 853
Re: Suggestions for Mahogany Charvel
« Reply #4 on: September 16, 2014, 05:01:02 AM »
Like a Les Paul, you say?

Ok, warm cleans = VHII.  It's a really warm pickup when clean and it can get gnarly when used with gain.  If you play with high gain and play in a 'shred' sort of a style, it will sound like a proper shred pickup but if you turn the gain down and dig in like a blues player, it will get suitably ill tempered.  Cleans are warm and they sing, but they are not bright. 

For a more blue / jazzy sounding clean the Rebel Yell N is good.  It's brighter than the VHII and can do great rock but it's smother and a bit hotter.  Rolling down the tone gives a nice round sort of a tone. 
Cleans are more open, bell like, and singing.  Brighter.  Great neck pickup though.

Bridge:  Rebel Yell is a great all around rock pickup.  It has a really even and surprisingly rich harmonic response with lots of overtones.  The bottom is clear, open, and tight but it can sound thin in a brighter axe.  Under high gain, it has a clear and open crunch like a chainsaw, and when boosted, it can get quite ferocious.  Very bright and great in a super warm axe.  I have this in a Godin LG  (All Mahogany axe) paired with a VHII neck.

Alnico Nailbomb:  I have this bridge pup paired with a Rebel Yell in my Les Paul.  The A-Bomb is a pissed off, hairy, and ill tempered rock pickup.  Turning down the volume pot on the guitar will give you much more traditional / bluesy type tones while leaving the volume on 10 and dialing in some heavy tones on the amp will get you right smack in Thrash territory.  It's definitely a pickup which will do metal and will do it convincingly.  Definitely an option worth looking into.

The Rebel Yell N / A-Bomb bridge is fantastic for my LP while the VHII N / Rebel Yell B is great for my Godin LG. 
I will say this about the pickups.

The A-Bomb Bridge and the VHII neck have a similar sort of a gritty and hairy character which is due to the unmatched coils.  i.e.  I believe one bobbin is wrapped with more wire while the other is wrapped with less.   Since the humbuckers aren't exactly even, you end up with more overtones.  It's a more aggressive and dissonant sort of a tone.

The Rebel Yell set has coils that are more evenly matched so the perception is of a more 'consonant' or 'pure' sort of a tone.  It's growls and sounds very even and musical.  The wide pick attack is also awesome.

Given your description of what you want for tones, I think that a number of options will work for you.  Just think about how much brightness, warmth, grit, smoothness, and aggression you want. 

I think with a VHII Neck / A-Bomb combo, you may find the VHII to be a bit weak in output compared to the bridge pup but of course pickup height can help with this.  I wonder if this might be what you're looking for tone wise.  It really depends on your guitar. 

The RY Neck / A-Bomb bridge I'd imagine wouldn't work for you since the RY neck doesn't have that 'shreddy' characteristic under high gain.  The RY Neck is an R&R pickup and will do blues, howling rock leads, Cream era Clapton, and Jazz type tones with ease. 

The RY bridge and VHII combo could work because of the closer output.  Also, using a Rebel Yell B with modern type amps and heavier strings is awesome because the pickup stays tight and clear under ridiculous amounts of gain.  The only downside is that it is not quite as 'metal' in spirit as either flavour of Nailbomb is.  I personally found that a boost is helpful for the extra punch. 

If you want a raw gritty sort of a tone, the A-Bomb bridge / VHII neck should give you the versatility you require and will do the metal thing in spades.  Listen to the Sepultura Nailbomb sound to get an idea of what I mean by 'hairy' or 'gritty'.  For a smoother tone from the bridge, a Rebel Yell (Bright) or Holy Diver (Warm) will be better. 

Telerocker, I don't know that Jazzers know what a bridge pickup is!!!  ;)

JohannvonDagg

  • Strawweight
  • *
  • Posts: 4
  • BKPs:
Re: Suggestions for Mahogany Charvel
« Reply #5 on: September 16, 2014, 11:34:39 PM »
Yellowjacket, thanks so much for the really detailed reply! I learned a lot and you've definitely helped set me in the right direction. I'm almost certainly going with the VH II in the neck now, the bridge will require some more consideration, but only because all of the options seem so inviting  :cheesy:
Luckily I've got a bit of time to make my decision, as I'll be needing to do a bit of guitar surgery before I can put passives in.

Yellowjacket

  • Lightweight
  • ***
  • Posts: 853
Re: Suggestions for Mahogany Charvel
« Reply #6 on: September 17, 2014, 05:39:37 AM »
Ok, to further assist I'm going to upload an audio clip.  Pick which guitar yours sounds the most similar to unplugged.  Yes, I recorded all my guitars unplugged to help me choose the pickups that best suited them.  I've uploaded this audio file in several threads here (I think they all got nuked in the board crash this summer) but I think it is also so infinitely helpful as a reference point for people choosing pickups because it demonstrates the core voice of some contrasting instrument designs.

OK.

#1 has a Rebel Yell bridge and VHII neck.  Note the particularly phat low mids, upper mid scoop, and low treble peak.

#2 has an Alnico Nailbomb Bridge and Rebel Yell neck.  Note the phat lows / low mids, center mid spike, and flat tapered treble response.  The low end on this instrument is far more open sounding and it almost sounds like an acoustic guitar.

#3 has a Juggerset.  Notice the still phat bottom but the far more present / brilliant top end.  This instrument is properly bright if balanced.

#4 isn't good enough for BKP but it is here as a reference.  It's an exceptionally bright instrument that sounds thin.  It would probably need warpigs, or maybe a Crawler set for lower gain tones.

JimmyMoorby

  • Guest
Re: Suggestions for Mahogany Charvel
« Reply #7 on: September 17, 2014, 10:12:20 AM »
The nailbomb works well for progressive metal in general.  For Opeth or Mastodon i'd recommend the alnico nailbomb maybe the ceramic for some thing like Dream Theater.

As for the neck I personally would try the cold sweat neck but the vhii neck would work well too as others would.  The cold sweat neck suits mahogony guitars and again I think it would be cool for akerfeldt solos clean and distorted.
« Last Edit: September 17, 2014, 10:18:41 AM by JimmyMoorby »

Duck2587

  • Bantamweight
  • **
  • Posts: 174
  • BKPs: Warpig, Mule, Black Hawk, Juggernaut
Re: Suggestions for Mahogany Charvel
« Reply #8 on: September 18, 2014, 01:59:39 AM »
Ceramic warpig all the way. Its a beast that can do Brutal metal all the way to jazz. Very versatile. Has great clarity too.
Amp-EVH 5150 III 50 watt, 2x12 cab with V30's, Creamback M and Hellatone 30, EP booster through FX loop
Guitars-McNaught, Vigier
Picks-Bronze, Stainless, Brass, Hufschmid

JohannvonDagg

  • Strawweight
  • *
  • Posts: 4
  • BKPs:
Re: Suggestions for Mahogany Charvel
« Reply #9 on: September 18, 2014, 08:59:26 PM »
Thanks for the clips! My guitar sounds most like the first one, which would indicate that a  Rebel Yell bridge/VH II neck might be a good idea, though I'd almost lean towards the Holy Diver bridge there just for the extra metal.
I still haven't totally discounted a Nailbomb, in which case I would deffo get an Alnico, my only worry is that the A-Bomb might not be able to handle the cleans as nicely as a Holy Diver.
I've read a few places that the Cold Sweat does really well in Mahogany, so it's definitely something to think about, but to be honest the clips of the Cold Sweat haven't quite convinced me, so I'll have to see if I can find more recordings of the Cold Sweat in a Mahogany solid body elsewhere.
While looking into the Cold Sweat, though, I also stumbled upon the Crawler. Do any of you have experience with that pickup? I think it might work in the neck position, but I've heard it's better in lighter wooded guitars such as Swamp Ash.
I've heard great things about the Warpigs from most anybody I've asked, but for some reason they just don't do it for me. It might be just because I've never been a great fan of ceramic pickups, or just their insanely high output, but something just doesn't click with me. I'd also worry about their bass response in my guitar, but like I said, I haven't yet found someone who says they're bad pickups by any means.
I'm going through phases where I'll be really set on something one day, and the next day I'll completely rethink it, but I bet at the end of the day I'll end up being pretty pleased with whatever I get.
I've sent Tim an Email asking his advice as well, since word on the street is that he's pretty much never wrong. I'm still waiting on a reply, but I'll let you guys know what he recommends when he gets back to me.