NAD (NAM?) Yamaha THR100HD

[AndyR]

I keep forgetting to come and post this...

I've had the dual amp  and 1x12 cab for over two weeks, so it's kinda more of a "New Amp Month" I guess!

It's pretty much WOW...

I did wonder with Richard's thread (https://bareknucklepickups.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=33295.0) why he seemed to love it but take some time to get warmed up to it. I can see why now. It's kind of a "grower".

It's simple to use. REALLY simple, but there's a lot of options to explore, so there's a lot to get through. You know from the word go that "your" sound is in there, but at the start you don't know whether you've found it yet or it could get even better... so I wasn't quite sure what to say.

At first, I configured the speaker output as per the manual for this speaker - 8 Ohm, 100W.

At low volumes (what I have to use) it was OK like that, but a bit "over-eager" on pick attack for my liking (I actually preferred my trusty THR10 with its 3" speakers!). I found that turning the final volume up (both amps have a Gain, Master, and then a Volume), actually smoothed that out quite a bit. But I ain't gonna be gigging, so it was "ho-hum, did we need to buy a cab for this?" (I was already having a LOT of fun on the Line Outs and Headphone with the speaker unplugged, more later).

After a few days, and reading on line that Class D power amp circuits, although better at delivering at low volume, still want to be turned up a bit, I suddenly realised I could safely select 50W or 25W... duh!

The difference was amazing for my application... WOW, suddenly it sounds fabulous at comparable volumes to the THR10 (not in wide stereo, though, obviously). I still can't get the final volume control up to 12 o'clock (halfway) - way too loud for our place. But it sounds fabulous between 8 and 10 o'clock.

The next big step forward for me was when the missus went to Country2Country last weekend and I had the place to myself. On the Saturday morning I got my Laney CUB 12 out and ran the two next to each other.

First I learnt a couple of things about the speaker - the Yamaha cab (Eminence speaker, I think?) possibly needs a bit of breaking in, and, on 1x12 at low volume I probably prefer an open-back speaker. I always used open-backed combos when I was gigging.

But then, bearing that in mind, I started trying to make the Yamaha sound like the Laney. It was REALLY easy to copy another amp next to it. The Laney has 84s in it, so I set the THR's power amp stage to that, and Class AB and then selected the pre-amp I'd expected to use (Lead). I set the controls roughly like they are on the Laney... and... nice sound, but nothing like it!! So I put the coffee on and scratched my head for a bit... and I had the AHA!! moment that has unlocked the amplifier. I switched the preamp to Modern, set the gain to the same as the Laney (about 2 o'clock) and the Master to around where I have to run the 15W Laney - about 8 o'clock... That's quite low, so I had to raise the final Volume. Bingo! That was it - pretty much the sound I've been playing on my Laney at home for the past x years. (Btw, as I turned both amps up, I found I actually preferred the THR as they got louder.)

Basically, what it taught me was to just "trust my ears" - doesn't matter if the preamp selected isn't the logically "correct" one for the thing I'm trying to emulate (or the output "valves"). After some experimenting you get a feel for what the 5 preamps do, what the output valves and class selector do. So you choose the combination you think might do it, set everything to 12 o'clock and go from there.

I haven't heard it make a bad sound - just some of them are nearer to that "oh my goodness my amp sounds good tonite" thing you sometimes got in gigs!

It took about a week, but it got to the stage where I will use the amp plus cab regularly. The THR10 stays downstairs and gets used in front of the TV. The THR100 is up in the "studio" and has found a nice corner where it doesn't sound boxy and the top-end doesn't strip one or other of my ears when I turn it up!!


Meanwhile - Line Outs... OH YESSSS... better than the THR10 (the headphone out on that doubles as a stereo line out). And it beats the cr@p out of my other direct options (Line6 XTLive, Vox Tonelab LE). Also, the dual amp thing comes more into its own - I can pan them across the studio speakers (But, actually, the dual, both on, thing works fine through the 1x12 cab - you can hear/feel both amps).

I haven't recorded anything yet, too busy having fun, but I will, don't worry.

[Plenum n Heather]

Nice. Congrats & enjoy!!

[gwEm]

Congratulations on the new amp. Technology really marches on!

Sounds like you made a good buy.

[richard]

Andy, glad to hear you've got your hands on the new amp. As you say, it's VERY easy to use but there are lots of options. After years of playing a single channel amp I really fancied having a channel switcher again but always ran into the same problem - I wanted two identical channels so I could set one for rhythm and the other for lead with a little more gain and volume. Amazingly, no-one seems to make one. Marshall should have done this donkeys years ago. They came up with the new DSL but gave it shared EQ with two very different pre-amps making it useless for channel switching - why do they do this ?

The Yamaha fits the bill. Two amps in one with identical features, none of them shared. I'm still working on getting my gigging sounds which are best described as older school British with the option of more gain/volume on amp 2. I'm getting close with the Lead pre-amp, the KT88 output stage, class A, the boost on amp 1 on a very low setting and the boost on amp 2 a few notches higher. Sounds killer. Better when it's turned up but still marvellous at not-annoying-neighbours volume. The Crunch pre-amp sounds great with gain maxed and a good dose of boost. The Modern works great for me as well with the gain set low and no boost.

Lots of fun ahead for both of us.

[Slartibartfarst42]

Despite my recent purchase of a new Strat for my collection and new pickups for it, I'm still carrying quite a bit of GAS for one of these amps. I have one question I'm repeating from when I asked the same thing of Richard and a new question:

1) How close does it sound and feel to playing a real valve amp, both at home and live?

2) Would it sound OK and be able to utilise the 2-amp function while going through my Orange 1X12 with a Vintage 30 speaker?

[AndyR]

Yep, I seem to be using it roughly the same way as you, Richard. At the moment I'm using the Lead preamp on Amp I and Crunch on Amp II. Can't even remember how the back is set, I think they're probably EL34 AB and 6L6 A, respectively. I've got the White boost on II and something else on I. Four sounds ready to roll - Amp I gives me my "british" crunch and lead voices, Amp II gives me a more "american" fenderish sort of vibe but will still break up (I haven't gone for a true Fendery sound yet).

This set up works nice for all my main guitars through LP-SG-Tele-Strat. Although, the strat (with ITs) does sound a little too mild and gentle on Amp II without the boost!

Works quite nice on Dual using these settings, though I find I need a different balance in volume between the two amps for humbuckers or fender-type singles - this is going through the 1x12, rather than studio monitors in stereo. With the studio monitors in stereo, the blend in the room seems a bit more tolerant of volume balance between the two amps.

And for a REALLY big sound, I leave the 1x12 plugged in AND send the line outs to the desk/monitors! 

@Slarti

1) Can't answer for live properly, but I do have some idea. Soundwise, I'd say we're virtually there. Feel-wise, it's slightly different. Not worse, not better, just different. I like it.

Over all, I'm getting to the point now that for home use I just do not need a valve amp, I prefer the way this (and the THR10) behave at home volumes to how a valve amp does. Having turned it up a bit, I suspect the difference between THR and valves might even be less at gig/rehearsal volumes.

2) Assuming that single amp works for you through your cab, YES, definitely, dual-amp will work too.

Like I said just now, I'm finding you have to be more careful over the relative volumes than I do when I use two sound sources. The other thing to bear in mind (this was a surprise to me for some reason, not sure why) is that both amps summed through mono give a sudden jump in volume compared to one amp or the other (duh!!, I suppose...). I get the same effect when I send to the monitors and have them both panned centre. Panned left and right, having both on seems less of a volume jump, more of an "oooh, that's a lot fuller".

I'd say, if you can, you want to try the amp with your own cab. I suspect you'll be OK because, at first, I don't think I liked the THR cab itself that much!! As I learnt how to control the amp, though, I got used to it and quite like the cab. What I discovered is there's a LOT you can do with the tone controls. I think I've seen on one of the videos that the guy says it takes to different speakers just like any amp would - it'll just sound a lot different through different speakers.

Later on I switched to trying the line outs - which is where the impulse response speaker simulation comes in... What I discovered was a HUGE difference in sound (line out and headphone) when you start switching the IR files around - some of the gain and tone selections I'd been making originally (and not loving through the THR cab) started making a lot more sense if there was a cabinet selection more like I'm expecting... But I'd already learnt to set the amp controls so I got the sound I wanted out of the 1x12 cab!

So, personally, what I've ended up doing for the moment, is setting the installed IR for ALL the preamp selections on both Amps to THR1x12(!). What that means is that the sound I dial up with the cab is pretty much (ish) what's coming out of the line out or headphones (by default, factory setting, each preamp slot has been paired with a suitable/appropriate IR - eg British 4X12 with a 57 on axis for the Lead preamp, that sort of thing).

[Slartibartfarst42]

Thanks, that's really useful. I hate to go over old ground with this amp but you know what it's like with these things; every new modelling amp that comes out, whether it's a Line6 Spider Valve, Marshall Code, Blackstar TVP or anything else, promises tones that are indistinguishable from real valves, clips sound great on You Tube and when you get to try the thing it's a world apart. I've tried a load of them (not the Marshall Code in fairness) and in each case, not only do they not sound like a proper valve amp, they don't 'feel' like a real valve amp either. In most cases it's not that it's too much of a compromise, it's more that the amp simply doesn't sound very good compared to the richness, bite, drive and harmonics you get from valves. If this is genuinely that good, it really will be a game changer for me and sooner or later, I will change.

[richard]

Slarti, I rehearsed last night using the studio's Orange Dual Terror through an Orange 2 x 12 cab. I really like this amp and very nearly bought one last year. Before rehearsing I spent a couple of hours playing the Yamaha at home so that the experience was really fresh in my mind.

I basically go for an older British amp sound with some extra gain when needed. I like a lot of punch and bite in my sound and find that a lot of valve amps compress too much as the gain goes up. Not the Yamaha - this was something that impressed me when I was listening to demos of the Yamaha. You can use a lot of gain and it still retains a clarity and definition that is absent in many valve amps. It beats the Orange in terms of playing dynamics.

One noticeable difference between the Yamaha, the Orange and my own Cornford is the treble response. In recent years I've found that many valve amps are well over the top in the treble department. I spent a couple of years rehearsing with various Marshalls - DSL, Jubilee, 800 and 900. I always started with the treble and presence set to zero and dialed a small amount in after I'd set the middle and bass. My Cornford generally has the treble around 11 o'clock. With the Yamaha set with all EQ at noon and presence set low there is nowhere near as much top end as I'm used to. However, you can dial in exactly the amount of top you want using the treble and presence. It bites and cuts without without producing that eardrum mangling treble shriek.

The overall sound I'm getting from the Yamaha I can best describe as 'muscular'. It's a powerful, punchy huge sound that gets better the more you crank it.

I have a Blackstar TVP 15 watt combo that I use for practice when there are other people at home. It's pretty good but in terms of warmth and tone it's not even close to the Yamaha.

Slarti, if you ever find yourself in the Brighton area you're more than welcome to come and spend as long as you like with the amp. You won't do yourself any favours trying it in a shop - you need time to experiment and think through the many options.

[Slartibartfarst42]

That's a very generous offer, thank you 

I can't say that I've noticed the treble issue on mine. If anything it has too much bass! It's also fair to say that the distortion on my TH30 can get a bit fizzy but then there's so much gain on tap that hardly matters. I usually try out guitar gear at Rich Tone Music in Sheffield but they're out of stock. Nevermind, I'm definitely trying it out some day soon.