Modelling VS. Real amps

[sambo]

lol searcher theyre pretty damn cool those brunettis... not the kind of tone im after but cool non the less.


go buy one.... now...NOW!


im gonna try some modellers and some amps cause i really wanna see this difference between valve and digital that i havent really experienced yet

[gwEm]

all this stuff about crowds not being able to recognise a good tone... i totally disagree!

its true a random crowd won't recognise if you nail a particular tone - either someone elses or one you had in your head.

but they will surely recognise if it sounds good... and they will recognise if your playing your heart out because you're really into it.

[sambo]

agree with you completely mate... thats what i was saying about peoples logic not making sense:

crowds cant tell difference but modellers are cr@p and only good for direct recording.....

doesnt make sense...

any way, yer i agree with you, but i think theres a certain standard of tone/sound you have to reach and from then on not many people will recognise a difference...

[carlaz]

For home-recording without waking the neighbours, modelling is great.  You just plug in and go at a moment's notice and you sound pretty good, really.  What's not to like?

For live work at the gigs-in-pubs/small-venues level, I'd vote for a good valve combo that fits easily in a car seat or boot and a handful of pedals to go with it.  If one can't afford an all-valve number, then I think the Laney hybrids are excellent value for the money.  Anyway, the keys are: Simplicity and transportability.  And relative resistance to spilling beer and falling bass cabs. ;)

(Heck, if I were a big major-label, touring musican, I'd have a giant stack o' doom for gigs, but still a Pod or something for the bus and the hotel! :))

[Dakine]

EXACTLY,
"If I was a signed recording artist on wortld tour", course would have a gigantic rig, free probably too.
But young Sam here is primarily a bedroom player and a jammer.
His band (so said) is not gigging yet.
He will be able to keep one amp.
A modellor will be able to supply him with a range of effects and also amp models.
This will be very handy/nice in his circumstance (remember all his, "cannot crank these amp" threads).
It's all very well (no-one in particular alluding to here) bleeting on about "pro" and "vintage" gear and "what will work best in a Arena setting" etc. Alot here, no matter age, will never get there or even aspire too.
In my opinion alot of people are becoming either elitist or dreaming.
I personally have a GT8. Is it the be all and end all? NO
When I get back to UK I am buying an Engl. To be "trendy"? NO. Cos I believe in their tone and build quality and it's in my price range (I am a 36yo adult and not a student).
How many of you gave up on somthing, wether when you were younger or not, because you got "bored"? Know I did.
Some kind of "solid state" effects/modelling device may indeed be very useful to Sam, not just because of it's choices but because (in this ultra high busy hustle bustle day and age) it will provide him alot of things to keep him interested and learn more about music/guitar.
Anyway, it's great debating/discussing the merits and dreams of certain gear. I just think we should keep in context what the person asking is really needing and more importantly can best afford :)

[dave_mc]

^that's true dakine.

as i've said before, he just needs to try them all to see, lol.

[sambo]

thanks for all the input guys...

and i know keep saying this but i WILL try stuff soon... hopefully ill be able to try some (not all) of this stuff on wednesday (although i might not be able to).... if not then, then it'll be some time this week....

and ill get back to you guys once i have....

[Spleen]

I was in a similar predicament years ago Sambo.  I really wanted a Mesa Boogie but didn't even have half as much money as I needed.  I went to the music store looking to buy a 5150 head instead.  When I was in the shop the sales guy invited me to try the Line 6 Flextone.  I tried the Mesa Boogie setting and... it rocked!  Was it as good as the real thing?  Almost certainly not but to me there in the music store it sounded freakin' awesome.  Then I dialed in a Fender tweed and had lush clean tones.  Dialed in a matchless for a great slightly dirty sound.  I threw various effects down and they all sounded great.  So... instead of the Valve 5150 I walked out with a Line 6.  8 or 9 years later it's still my live amp.

However, I've recently acquired something even better.  Guitar Rig 2.  The sound reproduction is incredible.  Noticably better than my Flextone.  It sounds so "tubey" it's not funny.  It's incredibly responsive to guitar dynamics and I know I would not be able to tell the difference between a real tube rig and Guitar Rig 2.  One mitigating factor is I have an Art tube preamp in front of the Guitar rig 2 signal and that may contribute to the tube like feel.

For recording guitar on computer, I cannot recommend Guitar Rig 2 strongly enough.  My Nailbomb order came in at the U.S. reseller finally so I should finally have my Nailbomb in a week or so and I'll work up some courage to make a clip.

Back on topic, I play professionally and use a modelling amp.  Sound guys love it, it's so easy to mic and sits well in the mix.  It doesn't sound as good as the real thing but it's in the ball park and also gives you a TON of options.  The caveat here being I've been a solid state guy from Day 1 and have always been used to that sound.  I love tube amp sound but I think the newest modelling amps come really close and give you much more versatility in the bargain.

If I had unlimited money I'd be hard pressed to decide between a Mesa Boogie Roadking, an Engl powerball or a Line 6 Vetta II.

That's my 2 cents Canadian.

[sambo]

^ interesting...!!!

i see...... hmmmmm

so how would a modelling AMP compare to a multi-fx/modeller like the POD XT live or something? is the flextone on a par with the POD?

[Dakine]

Sam,
flextone is an AMP, think $$$$. Pod is a lil plastic bean, think $.

You are veering off track young Jedi :)

[Spleen]

The new Pods are actually better than my Flextone as mine is the 1st edition Flextone that only had 16 amp models.  The Pod and newer Flextones have 32 and are more accurately modelled.  Pods sound great but you also need a relatively transparent amp to run them through.

The Flextone III would have the same tones as the Pod but come in an amp format, with a higher price tag.

The Spider series are cheaper but I wasn't as impressed with their sound in the store.  (That may have been my inability to get a good sound in the few minutes i had though).

The Vetta II costs as much as a Mesa Boogie.

Does this help?

[sambo]

teehee

i know flextone is an amp.... but i mean... may not be such a bad idea...

something to look into anyway...

interesting to know differences in sound.... and cost as well


EDIT: yes! sure does help thanks.... so in theory..... POD + keyboard amp = same tone (or maybe 'better') than your flextone.... (or at least VERY similar) which = VERY good (in your opinion for what you need anyway)....

hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

[Searcher]

The Spider series are cheaper but I wasn't as impressed with their sound in the store.  (That may have been my inability to get a good sound in the few minutes i had though).

Nah, I wasn't impressed either and I owned one for a couple of years.

[Twinfan]

Another thing with the modellers is that they're constantly being improved.  If you buy something now, it'll be obsolete pretty soon and worth very little.

It's not like an old Fender/Marshall amp or whatever that just sounds different (JCM800 vs DSL for example).  With modellers, the old models aren't as good a copy, so the new ones will always be "better".

Worth considering...

[sambo]

yer i see your point twinfan....
hmmmm