Bareknuckle version of a JB?

[robyogi]

this will be down to the asymmetrical wind and scatterwinding too.
The early JBs I've tested-one of which was Phil's- have all been symmetrically wound, part of the SD philosophy-which accounts for the way it behaves in the high end.

Hi all...I'm new here and noticed this mentioned more than a few times.  What's the difference between symmetrical and asymmetrical winding?  

It sounds like one has balanced coils (wound to the same specs?) and the other not, but what's the difference in terms of tone, response, etc.?  What advantages does each type of winding offer?  

Thanks in advance!

[PhilKing]

With symmetrical coils (the same number of turns each coil), the highs are rolled off more.  Asymmetrical coils seem to have more 'air' and have highs which are almost like a single coil.  The difference doesn't seem to have to be many turns.

[fps_dean]

Simple answer this one, The Rebel Yell.

deg0ey, the JB is quite a damn fine pickup but not perfect thats probably why hes looking for a BK with similar tonal qualities.

 :shock:

nah the bass is way too clear on the RY and it way more mids.  Completely different boat.

I think it's the Holydiver (which I think is also brighter and not nearly as muddy which is a good thing... ie what the JB's supposed to be).  The nailbomb is the appropriate magnet and output, but it's voiced much more evenly (and yes again has more mids and highs too, but not so much as the RY).

[Sifu Ben]

I think the amusing thing here is that everyone is right  :roll:
The thing that really makes me laugh on this forum is that everyone must have these massively expensive boutique amps which don't colour the sound of the pickups no matter what the settings are  :roll:
 Degoey is right, it is most useful to describe what sound you're after, especially with the JB which is pretty much the PAF of post eighties rock. The JB has been used by massively diverse acts to create massively diverse sounds, and as such there are several BK units which will approximate the sound of different JB using artists. The Crawler, Cold Sweat, Rebel Yell and Holydiver could all mimic a specific JB sound, so it's best to know what you mean by "sounds like a JB".
 In terms of cold hard figures, the Holydiver is the closest in terms of construction and output though.

[Dakine]

I think the amusing thing here is that everyone is right  :roll:
The thing that really makes me laugh on this forum is that everyone must have these massively expensive boutique amps which don't colour the sound of the pickups no matter what the settings are  :roll:
 Degoey is right, it is most useful to describe what sound you're after, especially with the JB which is pretty much the PAF of post eighties rock. The JB has been used by massively diverse acts to create massively diverse sounds, and as such there are several BK units which will approximate the sound of different JB using artists. The Crawler, Cold Sweat, Rebel Yell and Holydiver could all mimic a specific JB sound, so it's best to know what you mean by "sounds like a JB".
 In terms of cold hard figures, the Holydiver is the closest in terms of construction and output though.

Hoorah, voice of reason.

I have always thought;
a. people recommend what they have
b. amp (and guitar) makes a HUGE difference in tone, apart from our different hearing
c. why try and get a sound of another pickup from a BKP (not necessarily this thread). BKP's are handmade beauties and very distinct in their own right. I do not believe Tim goes, hmmm dimebucker, how can I mimic that and put BKP on it?

Horses for courses and all that but asking for certain sounding tones or band/player tones is great but there are WAY too many things involved to get it 100%.
How many have been bleating here and on MANY other forums for a Master of Puppets tone?  :roll:  Spend about , ooh I dunno, £10,000+ (before worrying about Hetfields fingers) and you may get close. I LOVE my BKP's and intend to put em in every guitar. And YES I have asked in past for opinions on what would be good for a specific type of sound/tone, but too specific is just silly IMO.

Just buy ANY BKP's and weep in delight at your gorgeous tones/sounds :)

[Philly Q]

why try and get a sound of another pickup from a BKP (not necessarily this thread). BKP's are handmade beauties and very distinct in their own right. I do not believe Tim goes, hmmm dimebucker, how can I mimic that and put BKP on it?

I totally agree with that (and with the rest of your post, and Sifu Ben's), of course Tim isn't setting out to make versions of other manufacturers' pickups.  And if you want something that sounds exactly like a Gibson Dirty Fingers (or whatever), then buy a Dirty Fingers.

But, I also understand why people mention other pickups when trying to choose a BK, because it's a much better reference point than saying "I want Gary Moore's tone on Empty Rooms".  At least they've (presumably) experienced those pickups in their own guitar through their own amp.

I have a guitar which has, at various times, been loaded with a 500T, 490T, 498T, Joe Barden Two/Tone, DiMarzio Tone Zone, MegaDrive and Fred.  So I might say I want something similar to the Fred, but with a little more midrange push and some grunt in the bass like the MegaDrive.  It's just a starting point, for me and anyone else who's tried the same pickups.

Just buy ANY BKP's and weep in delight at your gorgeous tones/sounds  :)  

I know that was just an off-the-cuff comment, but if it was that simple we wouldn't be here in this forum in the first place.  

[Dakine]

I guess what I was getting at is, with the advent of internet and sites to hear music easily, most of us can check a song and give opinion on sound. It takes alot more to check what guitar was used, what pup was in that guitar, what amp was used, what mic was used, mixing deck yadda yadda.
Tim makes some amazing pups that can cover many tonal ranges and styles. Many (if not all) are named after a genre (to my understanding), but this I want a XYZ pup but made by BKP (well buy an XYZ and be happy or send to Tim for a rewind) or, I want to sound exactly like so and so, is just abit hard to advise and silly.

It was 'off the cuff' but I do believe (and NO am not sponsored by Tim, wish I was) that especially in the field of rock (big field this :)) a BKP can deliver the goods over and above most anything out there :)

[ProjectX]

Here's my question: Is the Rebel Yell brighter than the Holy Diver or vice versa? The darker of the two will go into my quilt top Charvel.

[TwilightOdyssey]

Here's my question: Is the Rebel Yell brighter than the Holy Diver or vice versa? The darker of the two will go into my quilt top Charvel.

The Rebel Yell is the brighter of the two, all things being equal.

[Dakine]

TO, thought you may know.
What is yours in again? A custom strat type right?

[TwilightOdyssey]

M1 Tiger :) (which is actually going to get a Cold Sweat "soon" lol )

[Philly Q]

...but this I want a XYZ pup but made by BKP (well buy an XYZ and be happy or send to Tim for a rewind) or, I want to sound exactly like so and so, is just abit hard to advise and silly.

I think essentially we're agreed.  And of course the one essential ingredient the manufacturer/advisor can't factor in is the player.  You could give me Stevie Ray Vaughan's "No.1" Strat and his entire army of amps, and I still wouldn't sound anything like him.  

Wouldn't be able to bend the strings, for a start.  :)

[Dakine]

M1 Tiger :) (which is actually going to get a Cold Sweat "soon" lol )

you change around ya pups as often as underwear bro  :)

Good on ya!

[ProjectX]

Here's my question: Is the Rebel Yell brighter than the Holy Diver or vice versa? The darker of the two will go into my quilt top Charvel.

The Rebel Yell is the brighter of the two, all things being equal.

Thanks brother!

[deg0ey]

Degoey is right...

That's a first :lol: :drink: