Les Paul advice

[Gary]

I‘m in the process of saving up for a Les Paul Standard but I’ve heard horror stories about the quality of Gibson’s current output. I already have two Strats so I’m very familiar with their sound/ construction/ playability but not so much with LP’s. I’m thinking of spending the equivalent (approx £1400) on a second hand one but was hoping for some input from people on here. My questions specifically are:

Any particular views on this course of action, new vs second hand, any problem areas to look out for on second hand LP’s etc,

I’m aware that Chandlers in Kew and Vintage and Rare in Denmark Street both seem to have good selections but does anyone know of other shops in London that would be worth a visit,

I expect plenty of people will tell me that good quality Japanese copies or custom build is the way to go. These options are very much under consideration but not what I need help with at present as both have already been covered extensively in these forums.

Look forward to your input.

[Antag]

My advice could be summed up in two words: SHOP AROUND

I went through similar doubts to you a few years back (FWIW, I now own 3 LP stds).  Gibson's quality control is highly variable & there are some truly shocking instruments with "Gibson" on the headstock.

However, there are nice ones to be had.  You need to be patient, go to as many places as you can, inspect the guitars thoroughly & not get carried away when you see one that has the look (colour/finish etc) you want.  IMO you are taking a BIG risk if you buy unseen.

Things in particular to watch out for:
Fretboard & fretwork  - I've lost count of the number of Gibsons I've tried that had unevenly filed or poorly installed frets & poorly sanded fingerboards.  For example I remember one guitar that looked as if a fairly competent luthier had installed frets 1-8, then handed over to the cleaner who proceeded to sand the upper fretboard with a house brick, press frets 9-22 in so hard some of them pitted the board, then sanded them down until some of them looked almost painted on :eek:

Pickups - leaving aside opinions on tone, microphonic pickups can be a problem.

Hardware - some guitars have been on the rack for years with all sorts of people putting their grubby mitts on them so you will see corrosion (pickup covers & bridge/tailpiece most).  You might not mind the "aged" look but I like my guitars to look new.

Tuners - while most tuning problems actually come from the nut, I have seen some where one or two of the tuners are either very stiff, or so loose they "slip".

Weight - this isn't always the case, but the heavy LPs (>10lbs) tend to be very bassy (big booming bass, tons of sustain, but sometimes a bit muddy).  Lighter ones (8½lbs or less) seem to "sing" a bit more.  OK, I'm generalising & it's not necessarily true that light=good & heavy=bad.  Play several & listen hard to how they respond to your playing.

Most problems are fixable, but some of them (frets) involve major expense to put right.  I guess it depends how much you want a Les Paul.

Personally, I think it's worth it - I love mine :)

Hope this helps, YMMV etc...

[Jazz Rock]

My advice could be summed up in two words: SHOP AROUND

I couldn't second that anymore. Itry a few month ago two Gibson LPs in different shop, using them to try overdrive pedal.

The first one was a first class instrument. Never played such beautifully made guitar. Build quality, sound, sustain, pickups tonality, everything was brilliant.
Than the next week in another shop I tried another pedal with a Gibby LP. Never seen such an appalling fret job. And it sounded dull and muddy.

And they were both "called" Gibson LP Standard, but they were obviously from two different world.

So go shopping until you find one that feels and sound the way you like.

[Philly Q]

I agree with Antag's opening comments.  There seems to be an "all new Gibsons are cr@p" bandwagon rolling at the moment, and gathering momentum.  Unfortunately people who've never even played a Gibson start reading these claims and repeating them to all and sundry.

New Gibsons are NOT CRÄP (shocker!).  In fact in many ways they're better than they were 10 or so years ago.  Timber quality has improved, so it's less likely you'll see the bone-dry, pale fingerboards that were all too common in the 90s (unfortunately they seem to be using up the old shitee on the Faded SGs and Vs, but even then there are good ones).  My Pete Townshend SG even has a one-piece body, which I thought I'd never see again on anything other than Hamer or PRS.

However, new Gibsons are VERY INCONSISTENT.  There seems to still be quite a lot of hand-finishing at the Gibson factory.  I have two '99 SGs and the sanding on the body contours is quite different.  Also the finishing is a bit rough and ready - the nitro finish always sinks into the grain somewhere, especially on the sides of the headstock.  Personally I like these "defects" - it feels like I have a guitar built by humans.

I agree with Antag about the fretting and fingerboards - they still seem to install the frets pretty heavy-handedly, so there's sometimes a lot of pitting/minor splintering of the board around the frets.  Touch wood, this hasn't affected the playability of my own guitars (or maybe I'm just easily pleased).

The main reason I continue to buy Gibsons is the necks - LPs or SGs, those fat rounded neck profiles are just perfect for me.  I've owned Hamers whick knocked the Gibsons out of the park in workmanship terms, but I've always ended up keeping the Gibbos for those necks.  Of course that's a personal taste thing...

Again, as Antag said, shop around.  I'd buy a Japanese or Korean guitar mail order, but you need to try Gibsons to make sure you get a good one.

As for where to buy, Chandlers and Vintage & Rare are fine, but their prices are stratospheric.  If you decide to buy new, I'd recommend travelling a bit - try Peter Cooks in Hanwell, Coda in Luton or Stevenage and Guitar Village in Farnham.  The shops may be small and pokey, but they have big stocks on site and the prices are much cheaper.

[Antag]

Coda in Luton or Stevenage and Guitar Village in Farnham.  The shops may be small and pokey, but they have big stocks on site

+1

Also Andertons in Guildford might be worth a visit (got my Vintage Burst from there)

[msplines]

You could try contacting Feline guitars, they are not too far and are worth a visit.

[shaman]

if I bought a standard, I would shop around for a 2002 to present-check out various gibson forums/good info on this-there were some ?? in the 90's to 2002-my standard is a 2002-want fast neck??get the 60's neck..damn sure is fast!!my 2002 is a dream to play and a workhorse now that I replaced the burstbucks with a set of rebel yells-hell, I got 150 bucks for the bb's on the bay--that helped me fund my mm/cs set
rawwwwk on!!!

[CaffeineJunkie]

for that kind of money, you may as well chat to feline guitars about a custom built les paul, it'll be to your exact specs then, and you won't have to go to every shop on the planet

[Twinfan]

True, but you're stuck with it if it doesn't quite play/feel/sound 'right'.  At least with an off-the-shelf you can try before you buy.  That's very important to me.

[CaffeineJunkie]

True, but you're stuck with it if it doesn't quite play/feel/sound 'right'.  At least with an off-the-shelf you can try before you buy.  That's very important to me.

that's the idea of a custom-build, it's made to your specifications

[Antag]

...and you won't have to go to every shop on the planet

You say that as if it's a bad thing :?  - visting good guitar shops is FUN!! :) :D :lol:

[Twinfan]

True, but you're stuck with it if it doesn't quite play/feel/sound 'right'.  At least with an off-the-shelf you can try before you buy.  That's very important to me.

that's the idea of a custom-build, it's made to your specifications

True, but you won't know how the wood responds or how all the bits 'gel' until it's built.

[Bob Johnson]

True, but you're stuck with it if it doesn't quite play/feel/sound 'right'.  At least with an off-the-shelf you can try before you buy.  That's very important to me.

that's the idea of a custom-build, it's made to your specifications

True, but you won't know how the wood responds or how all the bits 'gel' until it's built.

It's possible to tailor the sound of a guitar to within very fine limits with good quality control. I've built guitars for guys, some of whom contribute to this forum, who have had very specific wants and needs and still nailed the tone they were looking for.

Custom building is not anything like the raffle you're suggesting it is TF.

Cheers,

[Gary]

Thanks for the responses, some good down to earth advice here which is exactly what I was after.

RE: custom build - Yes I am considering it and would almost certainly go to feline (he is just round the corner from me). At present I'm just exploring the option of a new/ second hand Gibson so keep the opinions coming.

[Twinfan]

It's possible to tailor the sound of a guitar to within very fine limits with good quality control. I've built guitars for guys, some of whom contribute to this forum, who have had very specific wants and needs and still nailed the tone they were looking for.

Custom building is not anything like the raffle you're suggesting it is TF.

Thanks for that info Bob.  I guess I should give custom builders more credit  :D