Which multi FX?

[Kilby]

Well as yourself the question, in reality how many patches will you actually require.

After 4 years of owning a Korg pandora, I only have about 10 patches that I actually use,  though I will tweak some of the values now and again.

I would suggest looking around for the m-audio black box as it's damned good (and fairly cheap atm) http://www.m-audio.com/index.php?do=products.list&ID=guitar

I agree with you regarding the Line 6 for Metal mayhem it works, but for just about everything else it dosn't really manage to convince anybody.

Vox use the so called "Valve reactor" which effectively treats the valve as being in the power amp section. This seem to help them sound a little more authentic than other companys products. Infact their emulation sounds better than the Marshall AVT series (and they are only supposed to sound like a Marshall), which uses a valve in the preamp section.

I would suggest going for what sounds best to your ears, and not worry to much about the number of features.

Let us know what you choose

[Doadman]

I think I am very much in agreement with you, hence I think it will be the Vox. I'm going away at the weekend and will try the units again on the 23rd when I know I will be at a place that stocks both. The more I think about it, the more the Vox appeals for that real tube tone. Assuming I don't overspend on holiday I'll buy it then. The only drawback is then I'll feel duty bound to post some clips of the Cold Sweat set that I use and my playing really is cr@p  :(

[Kilby]

I think I am very much in agreement with you, hence I think it will be the Vox. I'm going away at the weekend and will try the units again on the 23rd when I know I will be at a place that stocks both. The more I think about it, the more the Vox appeals for that real tube tone. Assuming I don't overspend on holiday I'll buy it then. The only drawback is then I'll feel duty bound to post some clips of the Cold Sweat set that I use and my playing really is cr@p  :(

It's so easy to say, but when you are in a shop and you are thinking, this has so many more options (or at least flashing lights and knobs), it's easy to ignore the, one that sounds better.

I think it's called pre purchase optimism

It's also a good idea to take some time away from the prospective items, before actually purchasing (why do the rest of us never do that).

I'ms still waiting for some money so as I can buy a set of pickups, and I will definately be getting somebody else to play on any clips my guitar produces.

[Watsonica]

I've had the GT-8 since 2005 and have never regreted it (well, only at first for a couple mins, when I was lost lol) , had used alot of others that wore out due to attrition and other factors but I think this one will be with me a long time.

About the number of effects and how many you'd actually use...well it's kinda like the gun philosophy...rather have it and not need it than to need it and not have it.

I get by on most gigs only using a couple patches but even those cover Rock-Jazz (I'm in a jazz trio) and Country. I run it thru a Marshall VS-8040 and sometimes the PA system in clubs, works fantastic either way.

If anyone doubts that one of these can't sound great they should listen to some clips of Robert Marcello on You Tube, pretty good I'd say, even tho he's not getting as good a sound out of it as I think he could.

I've used it on every recording I've done since 2005 and have really come to depend on it's versitility, I think all of those units in the poll are quite good but the versatility factor of the GT-8 did it for me, not only that...the longer you have one the better you learn how to make it sound. It can be quite a complicated lil monster.

I can hardly wait to put a bare knuckle thru it!! :lol:

[plastercaster]

since distortion is generally the weak point of these units, how about a versatile tube distortion pedal, running into the MFX, which would handle verb, delay, chorus etc. as generally digital does a better impression of these than it does an overworked valve?

[sgmypod]

yeah did the buy the one with most on(podxt) but now bought the one on sound...the Tonelab le

[Watsonica]

since distortion is generally the weak point of these units, how about a versatile tube distortion pedal, running into the MFX, which would handle verb, delay, chorus etc. as generally digital does a better impression of these than it does an overworked valve?

Many people have done that thru the loop of the GT-8 using a Damage Control ( womanizer..etc) and other units involving tubes with good results. I personaly don't have any problem with the Distortions in the 8 , I guess because I'm not using extreme gain and distortion like many do, and that seems to be where the "fizz" and aliasing will come into play.

[JDC]

n00b question: if you were using a multi fx pedal just for wah, boosting, delay etc into a tube amp doing the main overdrive

would the tonelab still benefit from having it's tube, I'm guessing it would but I don't want to speculate

[Watsonica]

n00b question: if you were using a multi fx pedal just for wah, boosting, delay etc into a tube amp doing the main overdrive

would the tonelab still benefit from having it's tube, I'm guessing it would but I don't want to speculate

Great question really, I'm not familiar with the Tonelab specifically but I believe your reasoning is correct, it's not unlike adding a tubed device into the loop of an MFX as I mentioned in a previous post and then running all of that into a tube amplifier....I personaly feel that a tube anywhere in the signal path is going to make a difference but I'm also sure that it amounting to a preamp tube that it's effect on the overall sound is arguable for some, where others will notice the difference..I happen to be one of the others ( lol).

For instance I have a Marshall VS8040 that came with a single ECC83 preamp tube that I switched for the U.S. equivalent 12AX7 of a different brand (Sylvania NOS) and I could tell immediatley from hearing and feel that it smoothed it out and took some of the "harshness" out of that channel (the tube only works in the boost channel) that it originaly had.

[Doadman]

Well, I've tried the GT8 and Tonelab again and I do now have a slightly better understanding of each unit but the more I discover the more difficult it seems to become.

Despite what some of the sales guys say pushing the GT8, there is no doubt in my mind that the Vox has the superior tube tone. There is so much you can alter with the GT8 that it is certainly possible to get some excellent sounds from it but the classic rock sound of a Marshall stack that the Vox does so well is always that little bit more sterile.

That would suggest that I am still on course to get the Vox and I may still do that but in playing with the Vox a bit more there seems to me to be a rather daft fault with it. Because of the way the unit is arranged it is impossible to have a Wah effect and Overdrive/Distortion effects operating at the same time. To me, distortion options are so important that they should have their own section. Either I'm missing something in the way the Vox operates or you must have to use either an external Wah or distortion pedal through the Tonelab's f/x loop. To me that defeats the purpose of having a unit like this as it is supposed to be an 'all in one' solution. Can you really get enough distortion just from the amp models without using a distortion pedal feature?

I've read at HC that many GT8 users swear by something called a RadTone Harmonic Converger but I'm unsure exactly what it does, where you'd get one from or how much it would cost. If anyone knows I'd love to hear your thoughts. Would it make the GT8 sound more realistically tube-like? Alternatively, is there anything else I can do to give it a more realistic tube tone?

[Watsonica]

@Doadman, I understand your concerns, the GT-8 however will allow you to put any effect anywhere in the chain, unlike most MFX's, you wouldn't have a problem with the wah.

Concerning the HC, radley (Hockingsmith) is Neal Diamond's guitar player (more than 20 years now) and inventor of the Harmonic converger, I don't own one of these myself (would love one, can't afford it, around $200 U.S.) and the device does all that it claims, Ive heard clips and read reviews of 2 years and yes..it does impart a "tubelike" sound to the GT-8 and makes "tweaking" the sound for patches less tedious by all accounts.

It is possible to get a very good sound out of just the preamps in the 8 without using the od/distortion pedal sims.

There are some alternative EQ's and methods posted at GT Central in lue of using the HC, but only an HC will get that particular sound that it is known for, it is after all an analog device and the GT-8 is digital, that isn't to say that you couldn't put a tube driven unit into the loop section to achieve similar results but the HC is truly one of a kind and he makes them to your specs. you can find him here:> http://bossgtcentral.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=152

Don't give up on the Tonelab tho unless you're dead certain, many people have been extremely happy with that unit.

[Kilby]

I personaly feel that a tube anywhere in the signal path is going to make a difference but I'm also sure that it amounting to a preamp tube that it's effect on the overall sound is arguable for some, where others will notice the difference..I happen to be one of the others ( lol).

The difference with the Vox moddeling is that the tube is NOT used within the preamp stage, it's used within the emulated power amp. From the demos here (and playing about in my local music shop) they do seem to be onto something better than the competition

I spent a while last week playing with a couple of zoom units, and like the marshall and other units that (allege to) use valve in their preamps, they are fizzy. Fizzy in the same way as the Marshall AVT that I have at home (and never use). I also find the digitech, boss and Line6 units very fizzy.

However other people are happy with them, and the other companys seem to throw more effects in than the Vox

For straight amp emulaton I find the vox (& korg) units to be ahead of the competition but thats only a personal view (but from hunters and steves clips it seems that many others seem to agree)

[noodleplugerine]

it is after all an analog device and the GT-8 is digital,

Wait wait wait - What?!

is this really true?

So they have a hundred mini circuits in there? I thought the sounds were generated in microchips and then sent through the tube - Are you telling me that every sound is generated with transistors and capacitors?

[Watsonica]

I personaly feel that a tube anywhere in the signal path is going to make a difference but I'm also sure that it amounting to a preamp tube that it's effect on the overall sound is arguable for some, where others will notice the difference..I happen to be one of the others ( lol).

The difference with the Vox moddeling is that the tube is NOT used within the preamp stage, it's used within the emulated power amp. From the demos here (and playing about in my local music shop) they do seem to be onto something better than the competition

I spent a while last week playing with a couple of zoom units, and like the marshall and other units that (allege to) use valve in their preamps, they are fizzy. Fizzy in the same way as the Marshall AVT that I have at home (and never use). I also find the digitech, boss and Line6 units very fizzy.

However other people are happy with them, and the other companys seem to throw more effects in than the Vox

For straight amp emulaton I find the vox (& korg) units to be ahead of the competition but thats only a personal view (but from hunters and steves clips it seems that many others seem to agree)

Wonderful!..glad you're pleased with the unit :) ...yes..I did say a tube anywhere in the signal path and that includes the post preamp, which is also possible with the GT-8 if one were to choose that option...doesn't seem that many do tho, although for playing live I can run it thu an all tube amp and achieve the same results.

I've heard great soundclips of the Vox and have done recordings with other guitarists (collaborations) that use them...Vox makes a fine product.

[Doadman]

Well, I've read the reviews on the net about the RadTone device and the only other product I've ever seen with such positive reviews is Bare Knuckle pups!! I've also e-mailed them and it seems that the Harmonic Converger does indeed make the GT8 sound significantly more tube-like, putting it into the same area as the Vox. Unfortunately, neither unit now offers the 'all in one' solution I was after. If I go for the Vox I will probably end up having to get additional pedals to give me more versatility and with the GT8 I'll need to save for the RadTone to improve the tube tone.

My initial feeling right now is that the GT8 looks a better long term buy and the nearest to an 'all in one' option.