Bare Knuckle Pickups Forum
Forum Ringside => Guitars, Amps and Effects => Topic started by: hunter on February 16, 2009, 12:39:39 PM
-
They cannot release such a georgous looking guitar and then charge 8,000 bucks for it!!!
This is vile!!!
(http://www2.gibson.com/CMSTemplates/Gibson/Stylesheets/Gibson/_Images/Gibson-HeroGraphic-MichaelBloomfield.jpg)
-
Is that a relic? Looks pretty beaten up to me, I wouldn't pay that much for damaged goods.
:D
-
:lol: I know the feeling...
-
I'm with you Hunter, it do look mighty fine (looks like it ought to be playing "Just Got Paid", "Heard it on the X", etc)
But... way too much for me to even get GAS over :lol:
-
I'd rather have your Edwards.
-
Is it me, or do all LPs look the same? Okay, the odd different colour here, the strange scratchplate occasionally, but really, what could possibly make this one worth 8k where you can get some perfectly great LPs for a fraction of that cost!?
It's a strange world we live in!
(PS I'm not saying LPs don't look good, btw)
Roo
-
I'd rather have your Edwards.
You give me that Bloomfield, you get both my Edwards!
8)
-
I like it - way too expensive though!
-
i sometimes think the only gibsons worth the money are a contemporary faded series or a nice vintage model...
-
Too much money, and I bet it's not actually that toneful. Gibson just don't choose the best wood for the best guitars like they should do. Having to play several £3500 '59 reissues to find a 'good one' is totally unacceptable to me. I would imagine this is purely a collector model based on the name/relic-ing.
<Gibson rant over>
-
Is it me, or do all LPs look the same? Okay, the odd different colour here, the strange scratchplate occasionally, but really, what could possibly make this one worth 8k where you can get some perfectly great LPs for a fraction of that cost!?
It's a strange world we live in!
(PS I'm not saying LPs don't look good, btw)
Roo
I agree.
-
Is it me, or do all LPs look the same? Okay, the odd different colour here, the strange scratchplate occasionally, but really, what could possibly make this one worth 8k where you can get some perfectly great LPs for a fraction of that cost!?
It's a strange world we live in!
(PS I'm not saying LPs don't look good, btw)
Roo
I see it coming, Les Pauls are the new Teles now :O)
-
(PS I'm not saying LPs don't look good, btw)
Just not quite as good as a nice tele, eh, Roo? :lol:
EDIT: ya beat me to it Hunter! :lol:
-
Looks a bit like mine! :wink:
(http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u76/d1dsj/DSC00371.jpg)
-
eight grand for an LP? daylight robbery, better off buying 4 different LP Standards and chucking in different BKPs...1 for MM, 1 for PG Blues, 1 for Mules, and 1 for CS.
The only problem with that plan is it almost makes me want to spend 8k!
-
I'd rather have your Edwards.
You give me that Bloomfield, you get both my Edwards!
8)
So it's a Mike Bloomfield "signature"? It looks good, but at the end of the day it's just another relic Les Paul with some mismatched knobs.
-
^ what he said :lol:
Where's the Brazilian rosewood fingerboard, Honduras mahogany, extra-lightweight East Coast maple etc etc. That's what would justify the price.
Other than that, it's a fat lass in a posh dress.
-
Is it me, or do all LPs look the same? Okay, the odd different colour here, the strange scratchplate occasionally, but really, what could possibly make this one worth 8k where you can get some perfectly great LPs for a fraction of that cost!?
It's a strange world we live in!
(PS I'm not saying LPs don't look good, btw)
Roo
I see it coming, Les Pauls are the new Teles now :O)
Well, they do have a "bulbous bit" at the top, don't they? I can see this gathering momentum. :lol:
-
Well, now you mention it, I've never been a particular fan of LPs...
:D
The top horn at least finishes vertically next to the neck, rather than going in too far like on a tele. Add to that the bridge, the headstock, the control plate... no competition, really!
Roo
-
^ what he said :lol:
Where's the Brazilian rosewood fingerboard, Honduras mahogany, extra-lightweight East Coast maple etc etc. That's what would justify the price.
Other than that, it's a fat lass in a posh dress.
:lol:
-
^ what he said :lol:
Where's the Brazilian rosewood fingerboard, Honduras mahogany, extra-lightweight East Coast maple etc etc. That's what would justify the price.
Other than that, it's a fat lass in a posh dress.
Well, so many of my idols have played one of those '59 types, it's hard to get that aspiration out of my brain. I don't associate any of MY big 'uns with PRSes (other than Santana and then the one 80s vid with Gary playing one :O)
It's an emotional thing more than a rational one ...
-
^ what he said :lol:
Where's the Brazilian rosewood fingerboard, Honduras mahogany, extra-lightweight East Coast maple etc etc. That's what would justify the price.
Other than that, it's a fat lass in a posh dress.
This one did! Sadly it's long since gone.... but at least I made a healthy profit :D
(http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u76/d1dsj/Donimage001.jpg)
-
How does it match up to a Vintage relicked LP?
-
Well, so many of my idols have played one of those '59 types, it's hard to get that aspiration out of my brain. I don't associate any of MY big 'uns with PRSes (other than Santana and then the one 80s vid with Gary playing one :O)
It's an emotional thing more than a rational one ...
I quite understand, Hunter. They do look great, and I appreciate the history of them. I just think it's a shame that Gibson don't do a better job of creating a great LP consistently.
-
Well, so many of my idols have played one of those '59 types, it's hard to get that aspiration out of my brain. I don't associate any of MY big 'uns with PRSes (other than Santana and then the one 80s vid with Gary playing one :O)
It's an emotional thing more than a rational one ...
I quite understand, Hunter. They do look great, and I appreciate the history of them. I just think it's a shame that Gibson don't do a better job of creating a great LP consistently.
I agree with Twin... it IS a bad situation when you have to cherry pick guitars of that sort of price due to manufacturing faults/ bad workmanship. But then I have played LOADS of high quality guitars that have looked flawless, but they just didn't do it for me in terms of feel and I don't mean the string action. Pretty much most good guitars still have to be tweaked to suit the player anyway. . I tend to play LP's 'coz they fit me! I know the build and finish is far from perfect, but would I sell them... no because the one's I have work for me. Mine get beat up and I don't mind that natural aging process... but if I had some other manufacturers top guitars somehow I doubt they'd look quite so cool with dings and dents. Each to their own I guess.
-
I quite understand, Hunter. They do look great, and I appreciate the history of them. I just think it's a shame that Gibson don't do a better job of creating a great LP consistently.
Me too. I've never tried 2 LPs in one shop visit that feel the same. With PRSs I find that they are always of top quality standard and feel very consistent. Big companies can do it if they really want to!
-
Exactly. You can tell the only thing of importance to the head of Gibson is $$$$$$$.
-
I'm with Roo hear (god help me :( ) but I'm starting to see LP's in the same light that I see strats. Personally I think I've just seen too many of them to really notice anymore. I still like them, but they bring on a total feeling of indifference (although I still see the odd one that I like).
Although in fairness, I might be getting a tele, so take that Roobubba you little space sheep :P
-
I'm with Roo hear (god help me :( ) but I'm starting to see LP's in the same light that I see strats. Personally I think I've just seen too many of them to really notice anymore. I still like them, but they bring on a total feeling of indifference (although I still see the odd one that I like).
Although in fairness, I might be getting a tele, so take that Roobubba you little space sheep :P
A Tele, eh? Your boyfriend buying that for you? ;)
Hahah you love it :)
Roo
-
Prices for all american guitars are getting daft because of the $£ thing. £1800 for a 2008 LP is a lot of cash for the standard model nevermind £8k!
I have to say however that my 2008 335 is beautifully built and has a flawless finish - just a shame the setup required major work to get even close to playable.
-
I'm with Roo hear (god help me :( ) but I'm starting to see LP's in the same light that I see strats. Personally I think I've just seen too many of them to really notice anymore. I still like them, but they bring on a total feeling of indifference (although I still see the odd one that I like).
Although in fairness, I might be getting a tele, so take that Roobubba you little space sheep :P
A Tele, eh? Your boyfriend buying that for you? ;)
Hahah you love it :)
Roo
No your missus is buying it for me to say thanks for the other night. You should stay out late more often :lol:
-
I'm with Roo hear (god help me :( ) but I'm starting to see LP's in the same light that I see strats. Personally I think I've just seen too many of them to really notice anymore. I still like them, but they bring on a total feeling of indifference (although I still see the odd one that I like).
Although in fairness, I might be getting a tele, so take that Roobubba you little space sheep :P
A Tele, eh? Your boyfriend buying that for you? ;)
Hahah you love it :)
Roo
No your missus is buying it for me to say thanks for the other night. You should stay out late more often :lol:
haha! Chance would be a fine thing though :(
-
Exactly. You can tell the only thing of importance to the head of Gibson is $$$$$$$.
But it's OK for PRS to charge $38,000 for a guitar, just because his holiness St Paul did 10 minutes sanding on it, and wrote his name in the pick up cavities? :lol: :lol:
And £20 for a control pot is acceptable, and not money grabbing?
-
Blimey, this thread is turning into a battleground! :lol:
-
Exactly. You can tell the only thing of importance to the head of Gibson is $$$$$$$.
But it's OK for PRS to charge $38,000 for a guitar, just because his holiness St Paul did 10 minutes sanding on it, and wrote his name in the pick up cavities? :lol: :lol:
And £20 for a control pot is acceptable, and not money grabbing?
I never said the pot price was acceptable, I just quoted the fact ;) And the Paul's 28 model is a complete joke!
But at least the regular models are consistently well built and sound good :)
-
Exactly. You can tell the only thing of importance to the head of Gibson is $$$$$$$.
But it's OK for PRS to charge $38,000 for a guitar, just because his holiness St Paul did 10 minutes sanding on it, and wrote his name in the pick up cavities? :lol: :lol:
And £20 for a control pot is acceptable, and not money grabbing?
I never said the pot price was acceptable, I just quoted the fact ;) And the Paul's 28 model is a complete joke!
But at least the regular models are consistently well built and sound good :)
True, but that's not the point I made. You attacked Gibson for being money focussed - clearly they're not alone! :wink:
-
Not at all! But at least PRS has an eye on quality too ;)
-
So that makes it ok to charge over the odds? :lol: :wink:
Guess I'll be sent for "re-Neducation" soon....
-
All businesses have to be money focussed otherwise they would be out of business.
I really don't see why this arouses so much ire. If you think a guitar is too expensive/ poor value for money then don't buy it.
There is now plenty of choice of new guitars in all styles to suit all price ranges.
Attention to QC is makes sense from a customer service level AND a business level. Fender went bankrupt essentially due to poor QC. Equally, having a good product hasn't stopped Matchless going out of business at least 3 times (mind you they had QC problems with their first run of amps....).
-
If you think a guitar is too expensive/ poor value for money then don't buy it.
Sound, sound words :D
I tried one of the roadworn fenders on saturday (the 50s tele) - it was a seriously nice guitar. SERIOUSLY nice, I couldn't stop talking about it when we went for coffee. It's the first time I've wished my missus could play, just so that she could feel how good it was...
But £799? It was not worth it to me at the moment...
My missus even wondered why, if it was that good, I didn't buy it and then get rid of some of the others like many do? But something just didn't feel right to me...
When I got home I found out what it was - my pimped Baja feels just as good, it's just it's got more lacquer on the neck (and it's staying there!) :lol:
I'd love to have that LP up the top of this thread (or one that looks like it and has no QC issues, etc :lol:), but I don't think I'm ever going to feel comfortable paying that much for a guitar - so I'm not losing any sleep :D
-
So that makes it ok to charge over the odds? :lol: :wink:
That's one limited edition model mate, not the upper end of their standard range!! :lol:
-
So that makes it ok to charge over the odds? :lol: :wink:
That's one limited edition model mate, not the upper end of their standard range!! :lol:
Is anyone else getting confused here?
Are they debating a "limited edition" control pot... or am I missing something :lol:
-
It's just Martin getting all defensive :lol:
I'm expecting nfe to chime in about the bad side of PRS any second too :lol:
-
I don't know why people get all bent out of shape... if you want a PRS and it ticks all the boxes... get it, if you want an L.P and IT ticks all the boxes get that one. One things for sure... no one will tell me what I should spend my hard earned on and I wouldn't tell anyone else. Guitars are great and I love all sorts .... Tele's, Strats, PRS, SG's, LP's etc etc... but no matter what style I get I have to like the feel of it. I've tried loads and loads of LP.s and found 3 I really liked and ended up buying, I've played loads of Strats, bought 3 and sold them all only to find I prefer G&L's, I've tried probably only 2 dozen PRS's including the Santana and non seemed to feel right for me, but I know there is at least 1 PRS out there for me... it's just finding it (I actually think Twins got it!! :( ). When my mates laugh at my old looking tatty ish LP.s telling me to get something better I just laugh.... it bothers them more than it bothers me :D.
-
Cool thread 8) :shock:
Another difference between a Tele and a Lespaul is you can spend around 1k for the modern american deluxe or the vintage 52ri and have a great feeling, sounding and set up real deal (not a studio/faded etc...) guitar... which leads on to the Gibson rant :lol:
I don't see how can anyone can really compare a Gibson to a PRS. It's not even possible to compare Gibson to the SE range because they are put together better, even with the new PLEK machine they're using the odd Gibson manages to go out the door with bad frets, not to mention that on most (not all) of the LesPauls I've seen over the last 12-18 months the wood is splintered where the stop bar goes into the wood and the binding more often than not doesn't meet the body.
A Lespaul standard isn't that much cheaper than a standard PRS (£300-500 depending on the dealer) either and the VOS that cost £3300 upward still don't come close to the PRS at £2000.
Having said all that... it's clearly a bit of a generalization to say the least as alot of LesPauls out there are KILLER and sound amazing but that's been my experience.
Also the Lespaul image kinda transends all of the bad stuff because, like Hunter said, the image is so damn iconic.
:D
-
Some of the issues described here about Gibsons may well be why we get asked to make so many of our Lions
I kind of feel that often when a company puts out a high price flagship model with a HUGE pricetag it serves several purposes
it gets us all talking about them
it creates a stupid amount of desire amongst some players
it stirs up the collectors market who buy them in a hope of an investment
and the funniest thing of all - they fly off the shelves - people sell stuff and beg , borrow or steal to get the must have item.
-
So that makes it ok to charge over the odds? :lol: :wink:
That's one limited edition model mate, not the upper end of their standard range!! :lol:
So? That makes it not a rip-off? Double standards alert! Need more examples? How about the upgrade costs for 10 tops etc? Or £40 for a strap? £20 for a pot?The Private Stock prices? Bombarding the market with any possible model, then replacing it with another slightly different one after a year or two? Paisley amps at silly prices?
It's called exploiting brand loyalty, and PRS will do it as much as anyone else, if not more.
I'm not being defensive either; it's not about Gibson, I fully agree with the anything anybody says about them.
They do make some good guitars, but I've no axe to grind... they need to pull their fingers out.
They're all the same....
-
I can't leave you boys for 5 minutes can I. Nice Les Paul btw but I'll let it pass. I would love to have one perhaps one day but I couldn't/wouldn't pay that for any guitar let alone that one. Anyway, seconds out...round whatever it is.....
-
There are no rounds, this is old school bare knuckle last man standing rules
-
That LP is gorgeous, but £8k is more than I'd pay for any guitar, I think.
-
There are no rounds, this is old school bare knuckle last man standing rules
:lol: :lol:
So that makes it ok to charge over the odds? :lol: :wink:
That's one limited edition model mate, not the upper end of their standard range!! :lol:
So? That makes it not a rip-off? Double standards alert! Need more examples? How about the upgrade costs for 10 tops etc? Or £40 for a strap? £20 for a pot?The Private Stock prices? Bombarding the market with any possible model, then replacing it with another slightly different one after a year or two? Paisley amps at silly prices?
It's called exploiting brand loyalty, and PRS will do it as much as anyone else, if not more.
Yeah, they're doing a lot of that recently. Slightly tweaked versions of older models which disappear after about 5 minutes (Aside: have they really discontinued all the CE models, or just forgotten to put them on the website? :o ).
And that is, in fact, very Gibson-esque. Can't tell you how many times Gibson have brought out a model and just when I'm thinking of buying one, they vanish off the face of the earth. It'll happen with the ES-339 next. :(
-
theres a time when that guitar would have been termed 'shop soiled' and had cash knocked off - relic?, pah!!! :lol:
-
I tried one of the roadworn fenders on saturday (the 50s tele) - it was a seriously nice guitar. SERIOUSLY nice, I couldn't stop talking about it when we went for coffee. It's the first time I've wished my missus could play, just so that she could feel how good it was...
But £799? It was not worth it to me at the moment...
Guitarvillage have the 50s roadworn tele up for £699. I rekcon they would let it go for about £60 less than that if you asked them nicely!
-
come on gibson, that's worth $50k easy...
and the funniest thing of all - they fly off the shelves - people sell stuff and beg , borrow or steal to get the must have item.
yeah, definitely. when prices rise, it's meant to make demand fall. unfortunately, what also often happens (it happened with houses too) is that it makes the products more desirable (would anyone want a rolex if it cost £50?) and people feel that if they don't get in now, they'll never be able to afford it (e.g. the houses).
:(
-
So? That makes it not a rip-off? Double standards alert! Need more examples? How about the upgrade costs for 10 tops etc? Or £40 for a strap? £20 for a pot?The Private Stock prices? Bombarding the market with any possible model, then replacing it with another slightly different one after a year or two? Paisley amps at silly prices?
10 top is not a £1000 upcharge, which it is on a Gibson R9 vs an R8. It's about £350 I think. Still too expensive I agree, but not as bad as Gibson.
Gibson Studios, Faded Studios, Studio Plus, Studio Premium Plus, Studio Mahogany, Studio Gem etc etc. I again agree that PRS and Gibson do it.
But Gibson do it worse ;)
I think the current model range from PRS has gone too far in the Gibson way - a lack of focus. And yes Philly, they have discontinued the CE range.
-
come on gibson, that's worth $50k easy...
and the funniest thing of all - they fly off the shelves - people sell stuff and beg , borrow or steal to get the must have item.
yeah, definitely. when prices rise, it's meant to make demand fall. unfortunately, what also often happens (it happened with houses too) is that it makes the products more desirable (would anyone want a rolex if it cost £50?) and people feel that if they don't get in now, they'll never be able to afford it (e.g. the houses).
:(
Couldn't agree more, high price = better in the logic of some folks whether it is justifiable or not.
Look how the cosmetics industry exploit this. 100 quid for some emulsified oil in a fancy pot, print a load of bollocks on the label and you have a queue of mugs biting the hand off Harvey Nichols sales staff for it.
Clothes...the fashion industry have obscene prices and more pretentious nonsence than any other, but they still pay the asking price. Look at the brand loyalty there.
So what do you do?
Go custom! :lol:
-
But Gibson do it worse ;)
So you admit that PRS do it? :lol: They rip you off in a high quality way that makes you feel good!
Anyway, I give up now; you win. :sigh:
PRS are a non-profit charitable foundation, dedicated to bringing music to the world. Paul shuns the dollar, refusing to turn his passion into a business, and build guitars himself in a small workshop, and sells them at cost-plus-minimum-wage to customers he knows by name.
You can make up my next post using the following words and phrases:
Borg; dystopia; creationist; blinkered; zealot; new messiah; sturmabteilung; BMW X5; U-turn; absolutely will not stop.
:P
-
I'm not sure what you're getting at Martin. You've missed my original point by a mile! I'm not trying to say PRS don't overcharge, because for certain things they do. The point I was trying to make is this:
PRS mainstream model = Custom 22 = £1700 for basic spec
Very good build quality, and pretty consistent from guitar to guitar. Some are better than others, or suit one player better than another, but most people would be happy to buy one sight unseen via mail order.
Gibson mainstream model = Les Paul traditional = £1600
Variable build quality, and weights vary a lot from guitar to guitar therefore producing bigger tonal differences and playing experiences. I'd be unwilling to buy one sight unseen via mail order.
PRS high end model = Modern Eagle II = £4500
Key differences from mainstream model to justify extra cost are:
* highly figured maple (always better than 'normal')
* nitro finish
* 57/08 pickups
* solid rosewood neck
* bird inlays
* fancy case
* gold hardware (OK, mixed but some parts are gold)
Gibson high end model = Les Paul '59 reissue = £3800
Key differences from mainstream model to justify extra cost are:
* flame top (not always better than a 'regular' guitar)
* longer neck tenon
* Burstbucker pickups
* vintage appointments (thinner rhythm/treble ring etc)
* different case
* PLEK setup
Do you see what I'm getting at? What you actually get 'extra' for your £2000 or so is actually not that much on a Gibson, and things like the pickups/plastics you can change yourself for a lot less money if that's what you want. The things you get on a PRS cannot be 'upgraded' that easily - maple, rosewood neck, bird inlays etc.
-
Did you know that Mr Smith is an endorsee of my Koch? :lol: Well not mine exactly but Dolph's.
-
Paul's a nice fella too
-
^ Very well argued TF, and makes perfect sense - he's gonna come up with something though! :lol:
But I'm in the camp of "for me personally, anything over a grand is too expensive for a guitar", so much of it passes over my head!
(although I realise I am going to need to revisit this notional "limit" soon... :lol:)
-
I know what you mean Andy, I had a 'ceiling' of about £1500 until recently!!! Funny how when you break that the sky becomes the limit ;)
I'm sure Martin will be able to add something, I mean this IS a discussion forum isn't it? We're discussing :) It's always good to hear other people's views.
Maybe I've got the Gibson Custom Shop wrong, but if they're using higher quality mahogany etc I would have thought they would say so?
-
It's hard to quantify value when your talking about the big brands because you're not paying for just the guitar, you're paying for the promotion, factories, employees etc...
Would Martamp, Feline and Legra cost what they do if it had to feed into the machine and maintain desirability etc... of-course not, they either made a moral decision about their product or haven't got big enough for it to make an impact yet.
-
I'm not trying to say PRS don't overcharge, because for certain things they do.
Hooray, there's my point!
That's all I was trying to say! I accept all the other points in your post, and if you actually read through mine, you won't find anywhere where I either defend Gibson, or criticise PRS guitar quality!
Overcharging is overcharging, sauce, goose, gander and all that.
Gibson do it. PRS do it. PRS' better quality DOESN'T JUSTIFY it.
Now I am done.
-
I don't want to get stuck in your domestic but by the time you account for the wages for the employee that assembled and finished the guitar, the factories rent and the promotion needed to create and keep the desirability it is worth it to me and doesn't seem to really be out of line.
I would feel the same about Gibsons too if the qc was up there-even more so actually, as you're buying into a rich heritage.
I think private stocks are really overpriced as in my experience they play and sound just as good as the standard models, but your paying for the exotic and rare woods where as with Gibson custom shop you're buying into the set up and QC.
-
But PRSs raw materials justify it to a certain extent, there is an extra cost in getting rosewood neck blanks compared to mahogany ones for example. The limited edition 'collectible' guitars such as Pauls 28s / Dragons / etc are probably the only real overcharging I see from PRS. The Private Stock program is a true custom shop and they can charge whatever they want if someone feels the need to order something daft with solid gold inlays etc! The vast majority of the guitars, i.e. those off the production line including 513s and Modern Eagles etc are priced well IMHO.
Gibson overcharge by CRAZY amounts for bits of plastic and minor spec tweaks. That's my issue.
-
But PRSs raw materials justify it to a certain extent, there is an extra cost in getting rosewood neck blanks compared to mahogany ones for example. The limited edition 'collectible' guitars such as Pauls 28s / Dragons / etc are probably the only real overcharging I see from PRS. The Private Stock program is a true custom shop and they can charge whatever they want if someone feels the need to order something daft with solid gold inlays etc! The vast majority of the guitars, i.e. those off the production line including 513s and Modern Eagles etc are priced well IMHO.
Gibson overcharge by CRAZY amounts for bits of plastic and minor spec tweaks. That's my issue.
However, regarding your brazilian RW neck Dave, I can well imagine that Gibson corporate policy doesn't permit usage of woods that are under import restrictions. That's the thing with a huge company like Gibson (who also own several other brands and have a much bigger turnover than PRS), the press would eat them alive, whereas a relatively niche manufacturer like PRS (even if growing rapidly) is not that much in the shooting line yet.
I'm actually not sure if I'd want a Brazilian neck myself, as I am not 100% sure to what extend those trees are in danger of extinction. Anyone have some official info on this?
-
Maybe I've got the Gibson Custom Shop wrong, but if they're using higher quality mahogany etc I would have thought they would say so?
Don't want to get too embroiled in this, but I would assume Gibson do use better quality timbers in Custom Shop/higher priced models, because.... that's what you do in a Custom Shop, isn't it?
I agree they don't make a point of saying so, but in their promotional materials generally they never really say much about timber quality, number of pieces of wood in a body etc. It's just their style.
When I had the Pete Townshend SG (which wasn't the Custom Shop one, just a high-end production model) it had a very high-quality one piece body, better rosewood in the fingerboard etc. Whereas my cheaper Gibsons have had two or three-piece bodies.
-
But PRSs raw materials justify it to a certain extent, there is an extra cost in getting rosewood neck blanks compared to mahogany ones for example. The limited edition 'collectible' guitars such as Pauls 28s / Dragons / etc are probably the only real overcharging I see from PRS. The Private Stock program is a true custom shop and they can charge whatever they want if someone feels the need to order something daft with solid gold inlays etc! The vast majority of the guitars, i.e. those off the production line including 513s and Modern Eagles etc are priced well IMHO.
Gibson overcharge by CRAZY amounts for bits of plastic and minor spec tweaks. That's my issue.
However, regarding your brazilian RW neck Dave, I can well imagine that Gibson corporate policy doesn't permit usage of woods that are under import restrictions. That's the thing with a huge company like Gibson (who also own several other brands and have a much bigger turnover than PRS), the press would eat them alive, whereas a relatively niche manufacturer like PRS (even if growing rapidly) is not that much in the shooting line yet.
I'm actually not sure if I'd want a Brazilian neck myself, as I am not 100% sure to what extend those trees are in danger of extinction. Anyone have some official info on this?
I agree, I wouldn't use a new brw guitar when I know it's in danger-same reason I wouldn't eat an endangered species (no offence Dave your axe is beautifull).
-
I'm actually not sure if I'd want a Brazilian neck myself, as I am not 100% sure to what extend those trees are in danger of extinction. Anyone have some official info on this?
I don't think they're allowed to cut down any Brazilian rosewood trees any more.
And any wood used in guitar production etc has to be certified as being harvested before 1992, or something like that.
Edit: Here we go:
Do I need a permit to export or import Brazilian rosewood? Yes. Brazilian rosewood (Dalbergia nigra) is listed in CITES Appendix I. Only plants, parts, products, or derivatives of Brazilian rosewood acquired prior to listing on June 11, 1992, may be used in commercial trade.
http://www.fws.gov/permits/faqs/FaqR.shtml (http://www.fws.gov/permits/faqs/FaqR.shtml)
-
However, regarding your brazilian RW neck Dave, I can well imagine that Gibson corporate policy doesn't permit usage of woods that are under import restrictions. That's the thing with a huge company like Gibson (who also own several other brands and have a much bigger turnover than PRS), the press would eat them alive, whereas a relatively niche manufacturer like PRS (even if growing rapidly) is not that much in the shooting line yet.
I'm actually not sure if I'd want a Brazilian neck myself, as I am not 100% sure to what extend those trees are in danger of extinction. Anyone have some official info on this?
My guitar was made before the really big clamp down happened in 2007. Up to that point, the use of Braz R/W needed to be documented but not in the way it does today. Rumour has it that Gibson kicked off about the use of Braz after PRS won their Singlecut lawsuit, which has made CITES etc clamp down on its use. Sour grapes? :lol:
I get everyone's point though. it's an endangered species and it should be governed properly. I'm all for making sure it's looked after in the correct way. I don't see a problem in using it if its from naturally fallen wood, old stock, or properly farmed trees etc.
-
Oh, as another point of interest. Most of the Brazilian rosewood that PRS used or still owns was old stock bought from the Martin guitar company. They decided it was too much hassle to use and document, so they sold it...
-
I like the way that the Gibson vs PRS issue has been hotly debated in this thread, whereas the universal truth that all Teles look cr@p has been quietly acknowledged with no fuss at all.
Magic :)
Roo
-
I don't see a problem in using it if its from naturally fallen wood, old stock, or properly farmed trees etc.
But that would be of minor quality, so no use in any PRS for it, right?
LOL
Anyways. I like your PRSs Dave, all of them. But even more an old flame burst Gibbo ticks my boxes, it's subjective after all.
In the end I might get a DGT, just because it's a damn fine looking, playing and sounding guitar, and I do like the occasional wobble on a Trem I gotta admit.
-
:lol:
Trems do nothing for me, but the DGT is supposed be an excellent instrument....
-
Next year gibson will make a perfect Les Paul. they will charge 35,000 dollars for it. Before you can get one you will have to prove you have at least five other Gibsons, you will have to write a formal letter to Gibson stating you want to buy one and you motivation. If Gibson management deems you worthy enough they might considder letting you buy one from them. Waiting time will be 6 to 12 months.
-
Next year gibson will make a perfect Les Paul. they will charge 35,000 dollars for it. Before you can get one you will have to prove you have at least five other Gibsons, you will have to write a formal letter to Gibson stating you want to buy one and you motivation. If Gibson management deems you worthy enough they might considder letting you buy one from them. Waiting time will be 6 to 12 months.
You joke, but Howard Dumble does this with his amps!!
-
I like the way that the Gibson vs PRS issue has been hotly debated in this thread, whereas the universal truth that all Teles look cr@p has been quietly acknowledged with no fuss at all.
Magic :)
Roo
Eh? When did that happen?
Have you been eating those funny mushrooms again?
-
Next year gibson will make a perfect Les Paul. they will charge 35,000 dollars for it. Before you can get one you will have to prove you have at least five other Gibsons, you will have to write a formal letter to Gibson stating you want to buy one and you motivation. If Gibson management deems you worthy enough they might considder letting you buy one from them. Waiting time will be 6 to 12 months.
You joke, but Howard Dumble does this with his amps!!
He also insists on seeing your record collection (and it must be on vinyl) to ensure your tastes are eclectic enough.
I have heard some awful noise coming from clips of Dumble and Fuchs amps
-
But whats the point of it all though? Surely he's there to build amps and not spy and discriminate your every move :lol:
-
Next year gibson will make a perfect Les Paul. they will charge 35,000 dollars for it. Before you can get one you will have to prove you have at least five other Gibsons, you will have to write a formal letter to Gibson stating you want to buy one and you motivation. If Gibson management deems you worthy enough they might considder letting you buy one from them. Waiting time will be 6 to 12 months.
You joke, but Howard Dumble does this with his amps!!
He also insists on seeing your record collection (and it must be on vinyl) to ensure your tastes are eclectic enough.
I have heard some awful noise coming from clips of Dumble and Fuchs amps
Well most of my record collection is on vinyl, although the Hammond organ records might be a bit too eclectic!
I've heard some awful noise coming from most brands of equipment, some of which I have been responsible for.....
-
PRS are a non-profit charitable foundation, dedicated to bringing music to the world. Paul shuns the dollar, refusing to turn his passion into a business, and build guitars himself in a small workshop, and sells them at cost-plus-minimum-wage to customers he knows by name.
And is this how you run Martamp?... because to be frank your amps are great but I know a few things i'd upgrade on one if I were producing them, I wouldn't use Ceriatone Iron personally, but profit factors in doesnt it?
everyone is out to make a buck Martin, and you stand by your product as much as Paul stands by his, don't stand there being all high and mighty preaching from the high heavens about quality, because I've tried em all over the past 17 years and I work in a shop were I get to try lots and lots of guitars and PRS are outstanding.
I know you also said you weren't challenging the quality, just the over pricing but it's all relative, and the exclusiveness of anything can drive the price up, u think 10 top maple grows on trees? ;)
-
PRS are a non-profit charitable foundation, dedicated to bringing music to the world. Paul shuns the dollar, refusing to turn his passion into a business, and build guitars himself in a small workshop, and sells them at cost-plus-minimum-wage to customers he knows by name.
I wouldn't use Ceriatone Iron personally
So what iron would you use, and what basis are you making that judgement?
-
Champ Electronics winds some pretty great stuff here in the UK but you pay through the teeth for it, i've heard it in hiwatt clones.
Heyboer wind some pretty fantastic stuff i've used a few of their transformers, Marstran, Metro.
Mercury Magnetics are alright too but I find them a bit brittle sounding.
It's all opinion, but I do find ceriatone's Iron somewhat muddy and lacking in harmonic content.
-
PRS are a non-profit charitable foundation, dedicated to bringing music to the world. Paul shuns the dollar, refusing to turn his passion into a business, and build guitars himself in a small workshop, and sells them at cost-plus-minimum-wage to customers he knows by name.
And is this how you run Martamp?... because to be frank your amps are great but I know a few things i'd upgrade on one if I were producing them, I wouldn't use Ceriatone Iron personally, but profit factors in doesnt it?
everyone is out to make a buck Martin, and you stand by your product as much as Paul stands by his, don't stand there being all high and mighty preaching from the high heavens about quality, because I've tried em all over the past 17 years and I work in a shop were I get to try lots and lots of guitars and PRS are outstanding.
Unbelievable! :x
Try reading my posts, you'll see that you are way off beam. :lol: FFS I've said several times I'm not criticising ANYONE!!!!!
The bit you quoted was IRONY. I was making the point that PRS are in it to make a profit just like anyone else.
I'm not "getting all high and mighty and preaching about quality". Read my posts again!
As for trannies, I use CERIATONE trannies on CERIATONE amps when the customer has ordered a CERIATONE and wants to pay CERIATONE prices. Get it?
(In fact most Ceriatone transformers are pretty good. I think both Dave and I, plus at least Sambo on this forum will attest to that.)
I use many other types of transformers in my other amps, as I see fit, and on customer request, which YOU KNOW because it's one of the things you've asked me in your various price requests. Allow me to quote myself from an email to you, 13th January 2009:
"I currently do the TW Express replica for £950, in standard Martamp spec with Ceriatone transformers.
You can specify alternative transformers if you like, and I’ll charge the appropriate extra amount. You can also supply your own, and I’ll deduct the transformer cost from the price"
I know you also said you weren't challenging the quality, just the over pricing but it's all relative, and the exclusiveness of anything can drive the price up, u think 10 top maple grows on trees? ;)
If you know I'm not challenging the quality, why say what you did in the rest of your post?
And if I'm challenging OVER-pricing, think about it. I'm not saying 10 tops should be cheap, am I? :roll:
-
I think now is a good time to bring up how great Caparisons are.
-
^ :lol:
honestly, if you ask me both gibson and PRS are overpriced here in the UK. For both brands you have other guys making either as nice guitars for less money, or far nicer guitars for the same amount. In my opinion. :)
Couldn't agree more, high price = better in the logic of some folks whether it is justifiable or not.
Look how the cosmetics industry exploit this. 100 quid for some emulsified oil in a fancy pot, print a load of bollocks on the label and you have a queue of mugs biting the hand off Harvey Nichols sales staff for it.
Clothes...the fashion industry have obscene prices and more pretentious nonsence than any other, but they still pay the asking price. Look at the brand loyalty there.
So what do you do?
Go custom! :lol:
definitely :D
(combined with buying from guys/companies who aren't completely ripping you off)
Did you know that Mr Smith is an endorsee of my Koch? :lol: Well not mine exactly but Dolph's.
hahahahahahahaha
-
I think now is a good time to bring up how great Caparisons are.
:lol:
(What is a Caparison btw? :lol:)
-
The molotove c--ktail of bkp thread subjects 8) :shock: :x :lol:
-
I thought Caparison was an astrological star sign.
-
The molotove c--ktail of bkp thread subjects 8) :shock: :x :lol:
we havnt had a good caparison ordeal in a while though have we!!
I think they suck :P
(actually i havnt tried one:) )
-
FIGHT! :lol:
-
The molotove c--ktail of bkp thread subjects 8) :shock: :x :lol:
we havnt had a good caparison ordeal in a while though have we!!
I think they suck :P
(actually i havnt tried one:) )
I think they, like, toooootally suck ASS.
(I haven't tried one either)
I thought Caparison was an astrological star sign.
This is the dawning of the age of Caparison, age of Caparison, Caparrrisssoooooonnn.... :sing1:
-
what has my Les Paul GAS started here? This is fully out of control ... :lol:
-
At least it wasn't Caparison GAS!!! :lol:
-
i actually quite liked the caparison i tried, just the price was a bit ridiculous.
-
PRS are a non-profit charitable foundation, dedicated to bringing music to the world. Paul shuns the dollar, refusing to turn his passion into a business, and build guitars himself in a small workshop, and sells them at cost-plus-minimum-wage to customers he knows by name.
And is this how you run Martamp?... because to be frank your amps are great but I know a few things i'd upgrade on one if I were producing them, I wouldn't use Ceriatone Iron personally, but profit factors in doesnt it?
everyone is out to make a buck Martin, and you stand by your product as much as Paul stands by his, don't stand there being all high and mighty preaching from the high heavens about quality, because I've tried em all over the past 17 years and I work in a shop were I get to try lots and lots of guitars and PRS are outstanding.
Unbelievable! :x
Try reading my posts, you'll see that you are way off beam. :lol: FFS I've said several times I'm not criticising ANYONE!!!!!
The bit you quoted was IRONY. I was making the point that PRS are in it to make a profit just like anyone else.
I'm not "getting all high and mighty and preaching about quality". Read my posts again!
As for trannies, I use CERIATONE trannies on CERIATONE amps when the customer has ordered a CERIATONE and wants to pay CERIATONE prices. Get it?
(In fact most Ceriatone transformers are pretty good. I think both Dave and I, plus at least Sambo on this forum will attest to that.)
I use many other types of transformers in my other amps, as I see fit, and on customer request, which YOU KNOW because it's one of the things you've asked me in your various price requests. Allow me to quote myself from an email to you, 13th January 2009:
"I currently do the TW Express replica for £950, in standard Martamp spec with Ceriatone transformers.
You can specify alternative transformers if you like, and I’ll charge the appropriate extra amount. You can also supply your own, and I’ll deduct the transformer cost from the price"
I know you also said you weren't challenging the quality, just the over pricing but it's all relative, and the exclusiveness of anything can drive the price up, u think 10 top maple grows on trees? ;)
If you know I'm not challenging the quality, why say what you did in the rest of your post?
And if I'm challenging OVER-pricing, think about it. I'm not saying 10 tops should be cheap, am I? :roll:
You're correct i missed the mark and im sorry, but i managed to wind u up real good.. 8)
-
This is the dawning of the age of Caparison, age of Caparison, Caparrrisssoooooonnn.... :sing1:
oh.... man... that song is going to be stuck in my head until I sleep now.
Cheers! :lol:
-
think i missed the carparison ordeal, so will jump in here with my 2c. i think they suck too.
my mate had a horus a few years back, it was ok, but just ok. dont like them lookwise, other than the angelus.
they are way too expensive for what they are and i cant stand the amount of fanboys they seem to have.
its like if a rubbish band like fall out boy was made into a guitar. for some unknown reason very popular, with expensive ticket prices, but just really not that good, best to avoid. :chain:
-
what has my Les Paul GAS started here? This is fully out of control ... :lol:
Hunter - you really need to think long and hard before posting on this forum again :lol: :lol:
99 posts on this now and it's still going fairly strong!
-
You're correct i missed the mark and im sorry, but i managed to wind u up real good.. 8)
Indeed! :lol:
I'm too old for this stuff.... :?
I'm off to build amps. This week, I'm mostly using British Danbury transformers.
-
So, Nvidia or ATI?
:D
-
geek! :P
-
surely this is bordering on thread lock...
-
Whisky or Vodka....grrrrr come on!! PDT_045
-
geek! :P
I can take that from you, Wez, but no-one else!
-
surely this is bordering on thread lock...
I use the Loc-tite variety - works well
-
surely this is bordering on thread lock...
I use the Loc-tite variety - works well
OMFG?! Surelee u uze sum sort ov wood gloo instead????
-
geek! :P
I can take that from you, Wez, but no-one else!
GEEK!!
-
geek! :P
I can take that from you, Wez, but no-one else!
GEEK!!
What are you, some sort of tele-lover?! :P
-
I'm off to build amps. This week, I'm mostly using British Danbury transformers.
Like this?! :?
(http://static.howstuffworks.com/gif/real-transformer-movie-5.jpg)
-
It was so wrong when they gave optimus prime a flame job
-
I think now is a good time to bring up how great Caparisons are.
OH NO YOU DIDNT!!!
(They suck! Well, the one I played sucked. Horribly. Oh no! Its begun....but in parenthisese, so its ok, right?)
-
:lol: :lol:
-
So, in summary,
gibson and PRS overprice the shite out of their stuff
Enough people are willing to pay it for it to be viable business strategy
Teles and caparisons suck
Yes, I think thats what we all said. Mmmmmm hmmmm.
-
Yes thats about the gist of it Mark.
Now then, who would like a nice cup of tea? :D
-
^^^ :lol:
I think that's about right!
-
Now then, who would like a nice cup of tea? :D
Been listening to too much king diamond, whenever i see an offer of tea i think of "them" and hear it in falsetto.
hail to the king
-
It was so wrong when they gave optimus prime a flame job
Everything about that movie was wrong.
-
It was so wrong when they gave optimus prime a flame job
Everything about that movie was wrong.
What did you want? Big boxes fighting each other?
The only big thing that was wrong is optimus should have been a match for/harder than megatron but then megatron couldnt have been a big bad.
And shouldnt have had a fishes mouth
or some dumb cube
Well, ok, you may have a point, but I liked it anyway!
-
I wasn't talking about how good it was as a Transformers movie - I never really saw the old cartoons etc, don't know anything about them except there was a Kick Axe track on the original movie soundtrack.
I just thought as a film it was a complete bag of shite. :P
-
Ah! I see.
I was a big transformers fan as a kid
-
Ah! I see.
I was a big transformers fan as a kid
Me too (Bumblebee was my favourite). I liked the film as well.
Philly - which is your favourite Transformer? You must have one!
-
Ah... we're back on to transformers again are we? Ceriatone vs ...?
What was this thread originally about btw? :lol:
Do you know what I'm thinking - it's not a thread at all, it doesn't belong here or in Time Out or whatever - it's actually the idea for a new category under "At the Back":
Time Out
The Dressing Room
That is Not Fair
The place for off-topic "off-topic "off-topic"" rants, raves, and attempts to wind each other up
:lol:
-
Philly - which is your favourite Transformer? You must have one!
The dead one. I don't know which one it was because they all looked exactly the same.
And I don't know when it got killed, because all the fight scenes looked like a big ball of crushed-up cars being rolled down a hill and filmed in extreme close-up.
-
A chap I work with said he didn't like the Transformers movie because "it wasn't very realistic". :|
I wasn't sure how to respond to that.
-
I wasn't sure how to respond to that.
Call him an idiot :D. I've still not seen it.
-
the transformers thing is profoundly off topic! but since you guys started it... ;)
i kinda enjoyed it as a really dumb movie, but it should have been so much better. like philly says, they did all look much the same, and the fight scenes were a confusing mass of twisted metal. which pretty much describes the look they gave the actual transformers! why do megatron and starscream in particular look like collections of random lumps of scr@p steel? really, whoever designed the thing should be shot slowly to death.
(for the uninitiated, being shot slowly means you start by blowing off a little toe, then another toe, well, i think you can see where it would go from there :) )
oh, on topic, yes, PRS and Gibson are both ridiculously expensive. Caparisons are crazy expensive! and Mesa amps are insane, generally at least double the price they are in the states. can someone explain to me how the new PRS Mira X is a "budget" version when the list price is over £1700?
-
can someone explain to me how the new PRS Mira X is a "budget" version when the list price is over £1700?
It doesn'y say who's budget, maybe Mr Stanfords, or the guy from Madoff Securities?
-
can someone explain to me how the new PRS Mira X is a "budget" version when the list price is over £1700?
It doesn'y say who's budget, maybe Mr Stanfords, or the guy from Madoff Securities?
The all-new, affordable (to crooks) PRS Mira X!
I can't really understand why it should be more expensive than the regular Mira, unless "sipo mahogany" and "African basswood" cost more than regular mahogany. :?
-
Price rises across the board on all PRSs means the Mira X is probably going to be about £1000. Same as the old one was, which will probably be around £1200 now...
-
I liked the Transformers movie. OK, the story isn't all that but the CGI was amazing. I liked the more organic styling of the robots. They look like machines who have evolved as a species.
-
this thread is beyond crazy,
first off, I demand roo take back is anti-tele comments!
second, nvidia vs ati, the answer is obviously nvidia (phsyx for life bitches!)
third, i don't have a favorite transformer, their transforming cars that shoot stuff, that's all that matters
4th, you have to be a sucker to pay for some of these custom les pauls, just get a Legra :)
-
Get a legra you say?
Dont mind if I do!
-
Does anybody else think that their sperm tastes weird after they've eaten artichoke for breakfast?
-
i've never eaten artichoke for breakfast, but if i do i'll let you know.
thanks for bringing a bit of dignity and decorum back to this thread dave! ;)
-
^ am i the only one who finds it a little disconcerting that, out of the two options, the thing you chose to deny was ever eating artichoke for breakfast? o_O
i loved transformers when i was young (still do... even if the series was just a glorified toy advert). the original movie was great, kickass soundtrack too. i actually quite liked the new film- it could have been better (the final fight scene was kinda cr@ppy, and also some of the choices of transformers to be in it were a bit strange), but it could have been a lot worse too.
my favourite transformer was either hot rod or kup (or maybe grimlock)... optimus was a given. :lol: i don't think any of those (bar optimus) were in the new film...
-
Grimlock rocked!
Should have been in the film, but how they'd rationalise him being a t-rex is beyond me.
Hot rod was a big pansy. Rodimus Prime doubly so. Kup was cool though. Optimus is of course, a given.
-
i've never eaten artichoke for breakfast, but if i do i'll let you know.
thanks for bringing a bit of dignity and decorum back to this thread dave! ;)
Oh God dude...
You guys are SO SAD... I can't believe you fell for that..
I don't eat artichoke for breakfast...
My sperm tastes great!
-
I'll never take my Tele comments back! NEVER!
Oh and Nvidia vs ATI was a trick question: clearly the answer should be based on the cost/performance balance at the particular price bracket in question, and not on some silly fanboi loyalty to one company or the other ;)
Roo
-
:lol: :lol:
This is one of the best threads ever!
I was too old for transformers the cartoon, i did catch it sometimes when i got in from work. I did see the movie and well i thought it was a good bit of fun.
I still prefer Iron Man and me mums still gonna get me an Iron Man suit for me birthday. A real one with jet boots and everything.
-
Yes, Iron Man was the better film.
But Grimlock would smash him. Pound him into dust, he would! Grimlock was the chuck norris of the transformers.
make sure your iron man suit has that anti-tank gun in the arm. You never know when you need an anti tank gun. Tough tin of beans or something, traffic jam, you know how it is.
-
Barricade RULES!
(http://bp0.blogger.com/_eTejdFXZbyM/SBkDXIv1huI/AAAAAAAAARs/wWQ8fAGKLCg/s400/barricade_robocar.jpg)
-
What the hell happened to him in the film anyway?
he just vanished.
-
He'll be back in the sequel.
(rumor has it he's a double agent.)
-
Oh, he got his ass kicked by bumblebee, and therefore cant rule.
-
Grimlock rocked!
Should have been in the film, but how they'd rationalise him being a t-rex is beyond me.
Hot rod was a big pansy. Rodimus Prime doubly so. Kup was cool though. Optimus is of course, a given.
i thought hot rod was awesome. to be fair, that was with a 6 year old's definition of "awesome", so... :lol:
i used to always hate ultra magnus, he was beyond useless... his heart was in the right place, but that was about it. :lol:
-
Grimlock rocked!
Should have been in the film, but how they'd rationalise him being a t-rex is beyond me.
Hot rod was a big pansy. Rodimus Prime doubly so. Kup was cool though. Optimus is of course, a given.
i thought hot rod was awesome. to be fair, that was with a 6 year old's definition of "awesome", so... :lol:
i used to always hate ultra magnus, he was beyond useless... his heart was in the right place, but that was about it. :lol:
Ultra magnus was a wet dishcloth. Fakimus Prime. Only good at getting his ass handed to him by gavatron (who was delightfully insane, at least in the comics, didnt see much of the revamped series)
-
Oh no is this still going on? Come on guys, let's get back to some serious topics. I wanna talk GAS and not transformers :lol:
-
Oh no is this still going on? Come on guys, let's get back to some serious topics. I wanna talk GAS and not transformers :lol:
you started it!!
-
I've been on Sennakot since i was given morphine and codeine in the hospital and the GAS I have had would inflate a hot air balloon! PDT_034
-
Oh no is this still going on? Come on guys, let's get back to some serious topics. I wanna talk GAS and not transformers :lol:
you started it!!
But roo, from welterweight to welterweight: Isn't this all a bit silly now?
8)
-
I've been on Sennakot since i was given morphine and codeine in the hospital and the GAS I have had would inflate a hot air balloon! PDT_034
Please make sure to post on this thread when you finally experience a substantial and or satisfactory stool movement.
I only ask because there is a lot going on in this thread and some of us could get distracted from the real issues by the meaningless drivel some less mature members of this board insist on posting...
Grow up guys!
-
Oh no is this still going on? Come on guys, let's get back to some serious topics. I wanna talk GAS and not transformers :lol:
you started it!!
But roo, from welterweight to welterweight: Isn't this all a bit silly now?
8)
Ah, go on, we haven't had a mad long thread like this for ages! :lol:
-
Oh no is this still going on? Come on guys, let's get back to some serious topics. I wanna talk GAS and not transformers :lol:
you started it!!
But roo, from welterweight to welterweight: Isn't this all a bit silly now?
8)
From welterweight to welterweight to welterweight NO!
Actually, am I a welterweight? I dunno. Have to wait till I see this post I suppose.
-
Yep!
Wonder when you get to heavyweight? I'm guessing either 10,000 posts or when Ol says so!
-
Yep!
Wonder when you get to heavyweight? I'm guessing either 10,000 posts or when Ol says so!
If Johnny doesn't have a goddam bowel movement soon that's gonna be a "Heavy Wait"!!
Does anybody know what O.K. is the abbreviation for?
-
Does anybody know what O.K. is the abbreviation for?
Here you go:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Okay#Oll_korrect
It's a bit of a read though.
-
Ultra magnus was a wet dishcloth. Fakimus Prime. Only good at getting his ass handed to him by gavatron (who was delightfully insane, at least in the comics, didnt see much of the revamped series)
yeah, the baddies in the 80s cartoons were awesomely evil... :lol:
EDIT: you can get back on topic if you wish :oops:
-
I've been on Sennakot since i was given morphine and codeine in the hospital and the GAS I have had would inflate a hot air balloon! PDT_034
Please make sure to post on this thread when you finally experience a substantial and or satisfactory stool movement.
I only ask because there is a lot going on in this thread and some of us could get distracted from the real issues by the meaningless drivel some less mature members of this board insist on posting...
Grow up guys!
Being a mature lecturing grown up in real life, let alone e-life, is enough thanks! 8)
-
Ultra magnus was a wet dishcloth. Fakimus Prime. Only good at getting his ass handed to him by gavatron (who was delightfully insane, at least in the comics, didnt see much of the revamped series)
yeah, the baddies in the 80s cartoons were awesomely evil... :lol:
EDIT: you can get back on topic if you wish :oops:
Agreed! I don't think it gets better than 80's cartoons in general, the modern ones seem to have replaced story with flash!
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2254/2312630292_2b385e6eeb_o.jpg)
-
Ultra magnus was a wet dishcloth. Fakimus Prime. Only good at getting his ass handed to him by gavatron (who was delightfully insane, at least in the comics, didnt see much of the revamped series)
yeah, the baddies in the 80s cartoons were awesomely evil... :lol:
EDIT: you can get back on topic if you wish :oops:
Agreed! I don't think it gets better than 80's cartoons in general, the modern ones seem to have replaced story with flash!
(http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2254/2312630292_2b385e6eeb_o.jpg)
Penfold plays a caparison!
(Danger mouse is a real custom shop guy. Greenback plays a TELE!)
-
Nah, greenback clearly plays semi hollow jazz boxes exclusively, just check out his attire-it screams jazz.
What a great idea for a thread MDV! Grotbags plays desert yellow RG550'S.
-
Nah, greenback clearly plays semi hollow jazz boxes exclusively, just check out his attire-it screams jazz.
What a great idea for a thread MDV! Grotbags plays desert yellow RG550'S.
no, no, that'd be Bananaman!
Welterweight, eh? :D
-
Yep!
Wonder when you get to heavyweight? I'm guessing either 10,000 posts or when Ol says so!
If Johnny doesn't have a goddam bowel movement soon that's gonna be a "Heavy Wait"!!
Does anybody know what O.K. is the abbreviation for?
O.K I produced a welterweight Churchill earlier. It should be making its way down the Thames later this afternoon. It will cause the masts of cranes in the east end to lower in sorrow at it's passing.
-
Oh, he got his ass kicked by bumblebee, and therefore cant rule.
Did he? You can't see the end of the fight in the movie.
Maybe it was a put up job. Maybe Barricade let him win. Here's where the double agent thing comes in.
-
Oh, he got his ass kicked by bumblebee, and therefore cant rule.
Did he? You can't see the end of the fight in the movie.
Maybe it was a put up job. Maybe Barricade let him win. Here's where the double agent thing comes in.
Interesting theory. I see what youre saying, but till further evidence comes to light, hes a big girls blouse.
-
oh man, 80s cartoons (not just cartoons- series too, like the a-team etc.) were the greatest. i'm well aware that i'm totally biased because i grew up in the 80s, but still. :D