How does winding influence the sound?

[Ratrod]

I'm guessing different windings can offer very different sounds. The Crawler and the Riff Raff are both AV PAF based pickups but each has a very different sound. The same goes for the Miracle Man and the Cold Sweat. I've heard more winds equals more mids. But there must be more to it than that. How does the winding shape the sound?

[Davey]

everything is in the winding.

two on the outside identical pups can sound like night & day once you plug em in

talked about diferent voicings with steve made possible with just winding.
example: ibanez powersounds are machine wound exactly straight. thats why they sound like pure cr@p. custom and butique pups wound by hand utilise scatterwinding quite a lot and emphasize layering of winds throughout the bobbin, making diferent voicings, mid humps, trebble bumps and bass tightness possible







(no, i didnt talk about this wiht steve from BKP.. it was Steve Vai ;))

[MDV]

Scatterwinding in particular increases the average distance between turns so lowers the distributed capacitance and raises the resonant peak of the pickup.

In addition exactly parralel winds leads to mutual inductance between turns and a more brittle sound.

All told you can make very powerfull pickups that still sound clear and very bright pickups that arent piercing

As far as specific widing patterns making particualr tones goes, sure enough it does, but thats the black art of BKP and all those like it!

[Tim]

It's not just in the wind, it's the wire gauge and type along with magnet choice too.Even pole shoe, slug and pole screw material have a huge effect on tone...........baseplate and covers too.
It's like all things............try to skimp or do things too quickly and the tone suffers.Patience and attention to detail are crucial in winding pickups.

[big steve]

not to mention chanting incantations, ritual dress, the odd seance...

[Ratrod]

Thanks for all the info. I was asking because I'm trying to figure out what the possibilities are for the GFS Retrotrons in my Dean Psychobilly.

From what I can tell by looking at it, the baseplate is similar to that of a SD pearly gates. The coils are about the same height too. Soundwise it has some similarities too. The difference is that it has a ceramic magnet. The ceramic magnet replicates the bite, snarl and attack of a Filtertron to my ears. It also has a dual screw coil. Others have said it's very similar to Kent Armstrong's Kentron.

I would describe the pickup as a mix between a late '70's, early '80's distortion pickup and a Filterton. I like the idea but would like some more sweetnes and growl. It also tends to get a bit muddy on the upper frets. I'm thinking Setzer's sound on the 'Rumble in Brixton' DVD on steroids. :twisted:

Can it be done?

[HJM]

Send to Tim for a rewind??

[Ratrod]

Send to Tim for a rewind??

That is the idea. As soon as I have to change strings on the guitar and if my next paycheck is good enough.

[Tim]

I've done several in the past few months and I can sweeten them up no probs!!

[big steve]

Ratrod, why do you know what the baseplate of a SD pearly gates looks like?

[Ratrod]

Ratrod, why do you know what the baseplate of a SD pearly gates looks like?

I owned one. It was in the bridge of my customized Tele I recently sold. The baseplate and the coils look very similar on the outside.

[Ratrod]

I've done several in the past few months and I can sweeten them up no probs!!

Tim, what kind of winding are you thinking about? 42 gauge plain enamal wire? Riff Raff style winding or Mule style winding? I like the growl of the Riff Raff but also the sweetness of the Mule.