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Poll

Whats your response to a recording tutor?

I want to learn to record and would seek the help of a tutor
1 (3.7%)
I want to learn but a tutor can bugger off
2 (7.4%)
I never knew of such a thing, I now feel that I can learn to record a bit, it was all quite daunting before
4 (14.8%)
I never knew of such a thing and wish I didnt
0 (0%)
I would learn, then go into competition with you to record other people
2 (7.4%)
I would learn, and then record only my own material because bugger working with other musicians
3 (11.1%)
Afghan Dave
15 (55.6%)

Total Members Voted: 22

Author Topic: Some market research, if you would please give your opinion  (Read 15108 times)

FredD

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Re: Some market research, if you would please give your opinion
« Reply #15 on: April 19, 2012, 08:05:01 PM »
Ah no !  Perhaps you are 'on' drugs !
A lot of young men are these days, especially those in the music industry.
It's nothing to be ashamed about, you can get help on the NHS.
Best wishes,
F.  8)

MDV

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Re: Some market research, if you would please give your opinion
« Reply #16 on: April 19, 2012, 08:31:33 PM »
Learning how to use a DAW is not difficult. Anybody that really wants to do it will find it will not take long to learn the basics. The rest you learn in detail as you need to.

True enough, simplistically speaking. DAWs are not hard to learn. For most at least. Some have trouble. The rest, as has been pointed out cant be learned well, save by experience. I'm a huge fan of that, and that would be reflected in my lessons.

Psuedo-sales-pitching aside, I know that none of my clients in this will be from this forum, so I shall speak freely:

- You can pick up what you need to as you go along, yes. There are easier and much more productive ways. The phrase 'necessity is the mother of invention' comes to mind. People often find things that were already within their ability in DAWs only after it occurs to them that the capability might be there to be looked for, after they need it. A decent tutor can show its there and prepare you for its use before you need it.

- There are far more complicating factors to recording than just getting your head round a DAW. What I propose is not just DAW training. I'm well aware of the the many facilities people have to learn their DAW of choice. Recording and mixing are vastly more complex than a DAW.

I was a little bored today so I started a mind map of the broad sweeping topics involved in recording, the things that you can benefit from an understanding of, in order to plan lessons. I tapped out at 3 very densely written pages of A4 of extremely generalised subject topics. Easy 200 topic titles, between 2 hours  and a lifetime each. Accordingly, I cant claim anything like total understanding of the topics I'm aware of, but I know that when I started recording, I wasnt aware that most of those topics existed at all. I could have carried on more or less indefinitely, but screw it, even going about it so egregiously simplistically I wasnt really getting anywhere, so I stopped to try and think of a better way.

- The same sort of logic (no pun, for those that use it) applies to effects. Take the humble compressor. All of them have (whether they let you control them directly or not) the same basic attack, release, threshold, ratio, makup gain. You can learn that very easily indeed. That no more really tells you what to do with one than learning the location of all the notes on a guitar tells you how to play it. Extrapolate that for every effect you can conceive of and then remember that the sound of everything affects the sound of everything else ;).

Fred: theres been a lot of good ol' fashioned working class reactionary diatribe in response to people using scary big words and typing lots of them on the board lately. I'm tired of it. Its retardation aggrandising bullshitee. I dont want to turn this thread into one of those threads but suffice to say: mocking being clever is not being clever, it is the opposite of clever /mini-rant. The reply was for Andy, I hope he appreciates it, and the humourous intention of its overwritten nature. And that line too.
« Last Edit: April 19, 2012, 08:34:58 PM by MDV »

Modular1

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Re: Some market research, if you would please give your opinion
« Reply #17 on: April 20, 2012, 07:55:19 AM »
If you really feel you want to share the knowledge, you should think about writing a book, but the market seems to me to be flooded with this stuff at the moment.

tomjackson

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Re: Some market research, if you would please give your opinion
« Reply #18 on: April 20, 2012, 09:55:14 AM »
There should be another option:-

I already know enough to make decent recordings, I'd be interested in a tutor if the tutor amazes me with their work and knowledge, otherwise I'll continue to record and pick up new things as I go.

I suspect that accounts for a big big chunk of people.  So it depends whether your happy teaching beginners or you want to open your market to other self taught folks who can already get decent recordings.  Perhaps you could make the difference between a decent recording and a great one?  So, playing devil's advocate, it would be up to you to sell yourself to me.
Some of the things I'd be interested to know:-

Who have you worked with?
What's your website?
Do you have a show reel?
Let's have some case studies.
What radio play have you had?
What are your qualifications?
How many years have you been professional?
Where is your studio?
What gear do you have?
What genre's have you recorded? 
Show me some positive feedback from clients
Show me some reviews of your work

Basically, what qualifies you to be a tutor? As I say, I'm playing devil's advocate, not questioning your credentials.
You can't tell people you are great, you have to show them.  It's a good first step doing the market research with this thread but asking people if they require a tutor will not get you as many positive responses as showing people they need a tutor.

So c'mon then, sell yourself!

Modular1

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Re: Some market research, if you would please give your opinion
« Reply #19 on: April 20, 2012, 12:42:34 PM »
People often find things that were already within their ability in DAWs only after it occurs to them that the capability might be there to be looked for, after they need it. A decent tutor can show its there and prepare you for its use before you need it.

The same could be said for the manual.

AndyR

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Re: Some market research, if you would please give your opinion
« Reply #20 on: April 20, 2012, 01:22:24 PM »
The reply was for Andy, I hope he appreciates it, and the humourous intention of its overwritten nature. And that line too.

I did, had me in stitches :lol:


The more I think about this idea though - the more I wonder whether you can actually get any (financial) return on it. There's a huge amount of work needed to prepare and deliver - is it possible to charge enough to pay for that?

And then (similar to what tomjackson's saying, I guess), I suspect that most of us into recording (or wanting to get into recording) are probably self-starting buggers who are not keen on paying a specialist until we've proved to ourselves that we can't do much better than f*ck it up if we go it alone... (you should see some of the DIY going on in our place!! :lol:). And once we've reluctantly agreed that it's been proved we're not as capable as we thought, we then want the specialist to prove that a) they can show/do it better, and b) the service on offer is worth what they're asking for it...


I think it's definitely worth giving it a go (not least because you learn a bunch more about a subject when you try to train/teach it, or even just draft up some of the materials/structure), but I'll be intrigued to hear whether it works out.
Play or Download AndyR Music at http://www.alonetone.com/andyr

Twinfan

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Re: Some market research, if you would please give your opinion
« Reply #21 on: April 20, 2012, 01:38:47 PM »
I have no interest in recording so I voted Afghan just to play along....

dave_mc

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Re: Some market research, if you would please give your opinion
« Reply #22 on: April 20, 2012, 01:49:24 PM »
- You can pick up what you need to as you go along, yes. There are easier and much more productive ways. The phrase 'necessity is the mother of invention' comes to mind. People often find things that were already within their ability in DAWs only after it occurs to them that the capability might be there to be looked for, after they need it. A decent tutor can show its there and prepare you for its use before you need it.

I agree wholeheartedly with that, but the problem is, will the people who you want to buy your lessons?

I'm not saying it won't work or anything, I'm just pointing out that you can have the best business plan or idea in the world (even objectively), but if no-one else agrees (or at least your prospective clients), it doesn't matter.

I only say that because you said you wanted honest answers. Plus i figure it's better to assume the worst and be pleasantly surprised. :lol:

MDV

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Re: Some market research, if you would please give your opinion
« Reply #23 on: April 20, 2012, 02:48:05 PM »
- You can pick up what you need to as you go along, yes. There are easier and much more productive ways. The phrase 'necessity is the mother of invention' comes to mind. People often find things that were already within their ability in DAWs only after it occurs to them that the capability might be there to be looked for, after they need it. A decent tutor can show its there and prepare you for its use before you need it.

I agree wholeheartedly with that, but the problem is, will the people who you want to buy your lessons?

I'm not saying it won't work or anything, I'm just pointing out that you can have the best business plan or idea in the world (even objectively), but if no-one else agrees (or at least your prospective clients), it doesn't matter.

I only say that because you said you wanted honest answers. Plus i figure it's better to assume the worst and be pleasantly surprised. :lol:

Yes, dave, thats why I asked! People are gonna have different perspectives. Andy and Fred want to go it alone. Thats cool. Modula thinks his DAWs manual can teach him to engineer and mix. Manontheedge and psy can already do an alright job and want to step it up, and a teachers something they would entertain for that. And so on and so forth. Most people just want to get some afghan dave.

Some people are gonna want a teacher, some arent, for various reasons.

There are plenty of books around, and I'm not high enough up the food chain to do that anyway.

Great post Tom. All true, I think (for some people anyway).

Modular1

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Re: Some market research, if you would please give your opinion
« Reply #24 on: April 20, 2012, 03:38:15 PM »
Modula thinks his DAWs manual can teach him to engineer and mix.
No. What you said was
Quote
People often find things that were already within their ability in DAWs only after it occurs to them that the capability might be there to be looked for, after they need it.

What I am saying is if people read the manual they should be aware of what a DAW can do even before they need the functionality. I said nothing about engineering skills and mixing skills. Please do not misinterperate what I say and then get all high and mighty, when its you that should have been clearer in what you were saying.

Modular1

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Re: Some market research, if you would please give your opinion
« Reply #25 on: April 20, 2012, 03:40:53 PM »
Did you know you can teaching qualifications in things like this? I know you can get certified as an Apple Logic Pro expert. You could perhaps teach in colleges and stuff. Don't you think its something you should look into? Either that or try to get your own big studio running?

Most kids that want to learn this stuff would probably be looking to go on some kind of college course that deals with it. This may all seem like I'm trying to shitee on your idea (I'm not.. I'd love to do something like it myself) but market in this is kind of covered as I see it.
« Last Edit: April 20, 2012, 03:54:27 PM by Modular Ian »

MDV

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Re: Some market research, if you would please give your opinion
« Reply #26 on: April 20, 2012, 03:51:11 PM »
No need to be all defensive, since it was your first post in here that suggested that reading the manual for your DAW would obviate any education in 'home recording'. I was perfectly clear, never suggested that I was just going to teach people to use a DAW and everyone else seemed to get that.

You, of course, just 'learn the rest as you need to'. *sigh* You do it that way, then. Not going out of your way to learn new things before you 'need' them (by whatever means available, not a recording teacher) is your loss. And a tremendous loss it is too. But, if thats your attitude, fine, I dont really care to argue you out of it. I should never have replied in the first place.

MDV

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Re: Some market research, if you would please give your opinion
« Reply #27 on: April 20, 2012, 03:52:41 PM »
Did you know you can teaching qualifications in things like this? Don't you think its something you should look into? Either that or try to get your own studio running?

I have. One home studio, one main studio and one additional studio that I freelance at. And yes, I did know that.

Modular1

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Re: Some market research, if you would please give your opinion
« Reply #28 on: April 20, 2012, 04:09:05 PM »
All I am saying is you are not offering anything that people could not teach themselves given the motivation. Home recording and producing is not rocket science. Tomjacksons post asked some very good points. I'm sure most people would rather spend their money on kit/guitars... and that I suppose is the bottom line on what you were asking.

MDV

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Re: Some market research, if you would please give your opinion
« Reply #29 on: April 20, 2012, 04:24:23 PM »
All I am saying is you are not offering anything that people could not teach themselves given the motivation.

The same is true of everything. Some people still choose to seek tutelage. We arent all the same, after all.