Epiphone SG, them pickups.

[Nitwit]

So, it feels like I'm here every other day with questions about something, sorry about that.
Anyways, as some of you might remember I was here earlier, or rather on the guitar forum looking for some info on the new Gibson Les Paul that came out earlier this year.
Then, this is the funny part. As I was about to go try the beastie, work called. And I've been cut back, long story short. The money don't stretch that far anymore. Yes, I'm sad, and abit mad.
But! I did decide on getting a new guitar this summer, and that's exactly what I am gonna do. Just had to go down in price a bit.. or rather, a lot.
I've been looking at that new Epiphone SG that came out not so long ago aswell (G-400 Pro), as it has the 60's neck I want.
So I thought I'd go for it.
Now, I don't have it yet, as it has to be shipped from the States, no retailer here carrying it (Long live Amazon), and as thus I can't actually try it either. And it's a cheaparse guitar so if those former garbage men handling packages at the airport break it, it's not gonna be so bad. But I've 'read' alot of good things about the guitar, so I thought I'd give it a shot.
Anyways, due to the time it actually takes to get it delivered, I thought it wise to decide on a couple of pickups now. If I absolutely hate the guitar, the pickup choice will go into one of my other planed purchases for the future, so no worries there either.

Now onto what I want.
I want the sound to be somewhat true to the original SG's, but still with abit of punch. It's not gonna go any heavier than Heavy Metal-ish (Think Judas Priest). But mostly it'll range from Classic Rock to Hard Rock. (Rolling Stones -> GnR/Slash)

What I want in Neck and Bridge I'm gonna leave rather open. I know I want good cleans in neck, but still able to handle abit of gain.
The bridge I'm rather open to anything, but it does need to be able to get some wicked singing smooth solos on high-ish gain.

I've been looking at a few pickups and, well, I can't narrow it down by meself, listened to some clips around the players forum, but it didn't help much, and some of these really lack clips.
Holydiver, Riff Raff, VH II and Black Dog. In various combinations for both Neck and Bridge.
Looked alot at the Holydiver for the bridge though, I can say that much. But open to suggestions.

As for what I'm gonna run it through. I ain't got a fancy setup of over the top valve amps and effects. mostly because I'm not at a gigging stage, and can't really justify the price on something I probably won't use as much.
 I'm a big fan of small practice amps, which are pretty much modeling of the various big boys, getting my THR-10 tomorrow (Finally, been waiting for it over a month) so gonna run it through that mostly. On whatever channel I feel is best.
Just gotta say, don't dis it till you've tried it, it does the job and it does it well, surprisingly well.

[TheyCallMeVolume]

I think a RR would be great here.

[metale]

If it was me, I would go riff-raff with a mule on the neck.

[Mr. Air]

I would go for riff raffs as you mostly plan to play a variety of rock. If you want a fatter neck tone go for a riff raff/mule combo.

[ericsabbath]

riff raff or vhII set
or a mix of those

and get a damn tube amp
a marshall haze 40 combo does the job well and is not expensive
there's plenty of other cheap options lately

[BigB]

Another vote for the riff-raff here. 

Oh, and get yourself a good leather strap, these Epis tend to be really neck-heavy.

[Nitwit]

riff raff or vhII set
or a mix of those

and get a damn tube amp
a marshall haze 40 combo does the job well and is not expensive
there's plenty of other cheap options lately

Yeah, thing is I need lowish volumes, I'd like to keep the apartment and whatnot. Not beeing able to crank a valve is a disgrace. But yes, I will get one, eventually.

Anyways, loads of votes for the Riff Raff here.
Which was what I originally intended for the Neck.
Now, if the Riff Raff is really what I want out of the bridge though, I don't really know, what little I've heard of it makes me think it lacks a tiny bit of punch, but the gain clips are really lacking here, so might just be "bad quality" on the few that are.
I'll look more closely into the Mule again, however I did find that rather lacking in the bridge department aswell. Maybe Mule Neck and Riff Raff bridge is a better combo.
The VHII I assume got everything I need for the Judas Priest stuff, which is why I included it in my original list, not heard a whole lot of clips of this either ofcourse, so it's hard to decide.
I'll put the Mule and VHII up against eachother if I can find some bridge clips, the Riff Raff too if I find one, and we'll see.
Cheers =)

[Telerocker]

RiffRaff's and SG's are usally happy couples. The Mule-neck will be warmer then the RR-neck, but the Mule is certainly not too dark. I have one in an all mahogany bolt-on Saint Blues. VHII's would be great too. They open, dynamic and punchy and very touchsensitive. When you dig in, they can scream. They will do hard rock and some heavy metal quite nicely.

[BigB]

Anyways, loads of votes for the Riff Raff here.
Which was what I originally intended for the Neck.
Now, if the Riff Raff is really what I want out of the bridge though, I don't really know, what little I've heard of it makes me think it lacks a tiny bit of punch

Err... Tried it in both a SG and (now) in a semi-hollow Hofner Verythin, and it's about as focused and punchy a vintage 'bucker can get. This or we don't have the same definition of "punchy" ;)

Now I can't tell if it's really what you're after - perhaps something a bit hotter and middier would be a better fit for you, but SGs tend to get muddy with medium-hot pups. You might be better waiting for your guitar and decide based on how it sounds unplugged. If it's bright, you may give the black dog a try.

The RR neck is a godsend BTW - very clear and defined, splendid cleans and smooth hi-gain leads - but you may prefer the Mule for creamier slash-like tones. Here again, depends on how your SG sounds, the Mule will work better on a bright SG IMHO.

[Nitwit]

Anyways, loads of votes for the Riff Raff here.
Which was what I originally intended for the Neck.
Now, if the Riff Raff is really what I want out of the bridge though, I don't really know, what little I've heard of it makes me think it lacks a tiny bit of punch

Err... Tried it in both a SG and (now) in a semi-hollow Hofner Verythin, and it's about as focused and punchy a vintage 'bucker can get. This or we don't have the same definition of "punchy" ;)

Now I can't tell if it's really what you're after - perhaps something a bit hotter and middier would be a better fit for you, but SGs tend to get muddy with medium-hot pups. You might be better waiting for your guitar and decide based on how it sounds unplugged. If it's bright, you may give the black dog a try.

The RR neck is a godsend BTW - very clear and defined, splendid cleans and smooth hi-gain leads - but you may prefer the Mule for creamier slash-like tones. Here again, depends on how your SG sounds, the Mule will work better on a bright SG IMHO.

Well, the difference between you and me is that you actually got the pups, all I have to go after is the very few clips I can dig up (that actually work). But I'm gonna trust your judgement =)
But yeah, I'll wait till it arrives, might be an extra couple of weeks till I can switch those awefull epiphone pickups out, but, atleast I'll get to break in the guitar. If bright go Mule, if not go Riff Raff, sounds like a plan to me.
So, neck is down to either Riff Raff or Mule. Happy with that.

As previously noted I like my brdige a tad hotter, which is why I was looking at the Holydiver, Black Dog and the VHII. Seeing how the Holydiver hasn't even been mentioned I assume that's not such a good match. I need that Bridge to cope with Heavy metal gain, which I'm not so sure the Mule or Riff Raff will do.
I know you said SGs tend to go muddy with abit hot pickups, but how hot? Will a SG usually be able to cope with the VHII or would the Black Dog be the best bet for the bridge, regardless of it beeing bright or not?

Primarily I want it to hold true to the SGs of old, the heavier thing is more about the forementioned work thing, which I don't know how long it will take to resolve, and wanted something that can bridge the gap, but still not be a "Jack of all trades, master of none", between my previous BKP outfitted guitar and the other styles I do play until I get that whole mess resolved. But it is in no way required if it's illogical match those pickups.
So basicly, if I were to hold true to the SG's of old, I should get a Riff Raff/Mule Neck and Bridge? Possibly Riff Raff/Mule Neck and Black Dog Bridge depending on the brightness, or did I mix it up?

[darrenw5094]

I have a Black Dog bridge and a Riff Raff neck in a Tokai LP. They are not a perfect match, but more versatile to me. BD has more overdrive gain than the RR in the neck, but i usually role the volume off my neck pickups anyway. Calibrated sets might sound like a good idea, but mixing the bridge and neck can give more versatile options than the boring matching set.

[Telerocker]

BD's with a mahogany body/maple top work, but in a big lump of mahogany they could be a bit (too) middy.

[BigB]

mixing the bridge and neck can give more versatile options than the boring matching set.

BKPs matched sets are not the same pup for neck and bridge, in fact they can be very different pups (ie AIV neck / AV bridge, or AV neck / ceramic bridge, etc).

@Nitwit:

The RiffRaff is possibly the closer match to the first SGs 'buckers so if you're after the canonical SG tone they're what you want. Then you can try a hotter / fatter bridge (BD comes to mind but re-read Telerocker's post about it) or a creamier neck (Mule), or a Mule set (but I'm not sure the Mule bridge - which I never tried - will be as punchy and focused as the RR). FWIW Deafcat64 seems to be more than happy with Abraxas in his own SG (cf https://bareknucklepickups.co.uk/forum/index.php?topic=28205.msg369766).

wrt/ the "how hot", it seems that the problem is mostly with "medium hot" pups, but it's more of a "general rule" and really depends on the exact guitar. Tim's "safe rule" is "either keep it really vintage or go full blast" - now some of us had good results with other choices (Abomb bridge for me, Abraxas for Deafcat64, and you'll find a few other examples I think).

[ericsabbath]

holy diver really didn't work for me and some other users that tried it in SGs
I remember someone loved it in a SG, but it was a supreme, with maple top, ebony board, so...
it was still amazing for leads, but sounded a bit dead for everything else (compared to the diver in other guitars)

the black dog has a lot of he holy diver voicing and tone, but it's a bit darker and softer
probably works in a SG, definitely not one of my first choices
might be a bit too smooth
I imagine a medium hot and bright pickup like the emerald might sound pretty good, though
but I'd stay under 10k, as Tim usually recommends, specially considering your main goals

Judas Priest has been using pretty hot and mostly active pickups for almost 30 years, but I'm pretty sure they used stock pafs and t-tops back in the 70's

[Slartibartfarst42]

The Emerald crossed my mind but that might be because I spent most of last night listening to clips of it! How about a Rebel Yell? It should be bright enough to cut through, will do Metal and also has a proper 'Rock' flavour to it.