Fav wiring for Hum/Hum

[n_mountain]

Hi everyone,

just wondering what your favourite wiring for a two humbucker guitar is??
I have only experienced the PRS five way wiring and I think it gives you some usefull and nice sounds.
What are your faves??
Which tones are essential??

PS: This is the post which was in the 'Pickups' room I just moved to Tech...

[deg0ey]

As far as I'm concerned, I'd be happy with a 2 way switch as I only really use one at a time. However, I do sometimes use the middle position on an LP type guitar, and I do make use of coil splits if they're there, but they're not essential :)

[WezV]

3-way switch with master volume and tone, if you want to get fancy you can add push/pull pots and have coil taps on each pickup

[froglord]

My Eggle is has a three-way rotary that gives 1. Humbuckers in series (traditional), 2. Humbuckers in parallel, and 3. Single coils. This, along with the three-way toggle, gives me nine combination.

To be honest, though, I mostly just use the humbuckers in series. The single coil sounds aren't bad, but the parallel humbuckers are just like dull single coils.

I suggest you keep it simple - a three-way toggle, plus a push-pull to split the 'buckers if you're feeling the need for more tonal options. This is the way my PRS Singlecut Trem is wired. It's nice and simple but offers a good deal of versatility.

[Eric]

Having volume knobs for both pickups can be nice. The ability to split volume levels for both pickups can be really useful. Also when both pickups are on the ability to mix a full on  neck pickup with a bridge pickup on 5 is good or whatever makes you happy. Plus two volume knobs and a 3-way toggle lets you do all those cool stuttering noises like Tom Morello.  :twisted:

Or if that's too damn simple for ya, you can always do this.  :mrgreen:

http://www.guitarelectronics.com/product/WDUHH3T1103

[n_mountain]

don't laugh Eric, but I once tried this with a Strat:
http://www.guitarnuts.com/wiring/mikerichardson.php
:D

I kind of grew up with 5 way switches so I'm used to them.
I once tried a Lespaul with 3 way and push pull for splitting and it didn't work out that well for me cause sometimes I had to handle two switches at once and just didn't have enough time. But as I said it is more a matter of getting used to it...
(I know I probably just switch to much in a song :))

The single coil sounds aren't bad, but the parallel humbuckers are just like dull single coils.

Interesting I always thought parallel humbuckers would be nicer...like a fatter, louder single coil, but I haven't tried them so much.

[gwEm]

Interesting I always thought parallel humbuckers would be nicer...like a fatter, louder single coil, but I haven't tried them so much.

i was once bored by the muddy bass in a modern super-distortion. i wired it up in parallel to see what it would sound like and it was pretty useful. i prefered it to coil tapped.

[WezV]

Interesting I always thought parallel humbuckers would be nicer...like a fatter, louder single coil, but I haven't tried them so much.

it really depends on the pickups and what you like, some pickups split better than others, most sound naff

[froglord]

Interesting I always thought parallel humbuckers would be nicer...like a fatter, louder single coil, but I haven't tried them so much.

Depends what you're after, I suppose. My experience is with the Mules, which are very vintage in character. It might work better with a more modern, trebly humbucker.

[Fourth Feline]

As a Peter Green/Snowy White fan, my favourite is the wiring that allows you to put them out of phase with each other in the middle toggle postion of a 3 position switch. Tim sells the Double pole/double throw switch integrated into a log taper tone pot, so a simple pull up of the bridge tone pot shaft puts them out of phase and pushing it back flush to the guitar body puts them back 'normal' again. The wiring is simple too, but you need at least one p/u to be 4 conductor wired.

The sound I refer to is to be heard on Gary Moore's versions of "Need your love so bad", "Jumpin at Shadows", "Love that burns" or the original Peter Green versions on early Fleetwood Mac recordings.  

Gary Moore's versions are  probably easier to obtain. You will find them on the albums "Blues for Greeny", "After Hours" or "Best of the blues".

The tracks where he employs the out of phase effect are fairly obvious, it's a very nasal almost claustrophobic tone. Rather like a Les Paul singing with a peg on it's nose !

 :D

[WezV]

As a Peter Green/Snowy White fan, my favourite is the wiring that allows you to put them out of phase with each other in the middle toggle postion of a 3 position switch. Tim sells the Double pole/double throw switch integrated into a log taper tone pot, so a simple pull up of the bridge tone pot shaft puts them out of phase and pushing it back flush to the guitar body puts them back 'normal' again. The wiring is simple too, but you need at least one p/u to be 4 conductor wired.

I get confused easily by phase issues but i think the Peter Greeen out of phase sound is different to what you suggest doing.  The switch you are adding will make the pickups 'electrically out of phase' with each other, as far as i am aware his pickups 'were magneticly out of phase'.  I am not sure if there is much difference in the sound because i havn't experimented enough so it may be that yours is close enough not to matter and i am just being picky for the sake of it

To make a pickup electrically in/out of phase you flip the hot/ground wires around, thats what your switch does.  To make it magnetically in/out of phase you take the pickup apart and flip the magnet around.

[deg0ey]

you flip the hot/ground wires around, thats what your switch does.  To make it magnetically in/out of phase you take the pickup apart and flip the magnet around.

Or put it in upside down - I think that was how Mr Green accidentally discovered it to start with (or am I making this up?)

[Fourth Feline]

Hi chaps,

Just to put the record straight, ( as helped by the mighty Tim Mills ) there are three facts:

1) the pickup direction (i.e. the direction in which the screw coil is pointing in relation to the neck or bridge) - does not put the p/u out of phase. The only subtle difference may be in power, as the coil not holding the adjustable screws is slightly more 'powerfull' due to being directly sat over the magnet. That was stated on the Seymour Duncan Q & A site.

2) I managed to get a subtle out of phase effect by flipping the magnet over in one pickup by 180 degrees (on one of my original Gibson pickups) - but re-inserting it in the same direction it came out - but upside down. This was quoted as being authentic by the U.K. 'Guitarist' magazine.

3) I then spoke to Tim at BKP when buying my 'Mules' and he said that he had spoken to the Luthier who had actually examined the Peter Green/Gary Moore Les Paul and had found one coil reverse wired.

I then did it by the wired method ( on my ' Mules' ) instead of my old Gibson p/u which had the magnet flip.

Sure enough the effect was much more dramatic and authentic.

One final note; I found the sweetest balance by going against convetional wisdom and having the brige pickup slightly lower than the neck. Before I did this, I had to turn down the bridge volume to 9 in order to get perfect 'Greeny' tones. The gap between the fretted strings and top of polepieces is now Neck = 2mm and bridge = 3mm.

Again I thank Tim at BKP, as he revealed between 2-3mm to be his own favourite Les Paul setting  for pickup heights.

Regards,

Derek.    :D

[WezV]

deg0ey:-  Thats a common misconception, even wikepedia says thats how Green got his tone.  He did have his neck pickup reversed but like forth feline says, it has very little effect on the sound.  

The old gibson pickups where quite inconsistent and the phase effect (magnetic or electric) can be more or less prominent depending on the particular specs of individual pickups.  Peter Green's wasnt the only gibson to come with an out of phase pickup, Jimi's black (and heavily painted) flying Vee reportedly had one too!!

I must have read the thing in guitarist about PG's les paul!!

I have made a couple of humbuckers and single coils because i am a luthier and i thought it was important to learn about the things i rely on and why its worth me paying so much money to Tim.  I got a great out of phase sound on one of mine by reversing the magnet but this was a very shoddily made pickup and i hadnt counted windings or anything.  It was literally a case of wind as much wire as would fit on each coil as possible so the chances of the coils being matched were very slim.  

Forth Feline:  do you have your Humbuckers wired out of phase with each other or out of phase with themselves

[Fourth Feline]

Hello Wez,

I have my humbuckers wired out of phase with each other when the switch is activated. That way each pickup sounds completely 'stock' when used on it's own, and in the middle toggle position they blend in the normal way. It's only the combination of middle toggle and tone pot pulled up that activates the 'Greeny' sound. Apparently Snowy White has had his Goldtop done this way too.

I then find that the degree of the effect is adjusted by turning down one of the volume controls; hence giving it's phase opposite pickup more or less opposition. The reason I then lowered the bridge pickup just 1mm lower than the neck p/u was to achieve my favourite balance with both volumes on 10. The added bonus was that the treble p/u became even sweeter sounding even when used alone. To be exact a gap ( between fretted string and top of polepiece) of 3mm bridge, 2mm neck.

I attach the wiring diagram for the DPDT switch so you can see what I may not have explained very well. The braiding still goes to the back of the pot(s) and thus to earth,  the white and green remain joined just as they left the factory- leaving the black and red hot/cold wires to go to the middle two posts of the switch. The diagram makes the rest obvious.

As the switch stands vertical, the mids connect to the bottom row when pressed down. I therefore put both 'hot' connections from pickup on the middle pin and out to the volume pot on the lower pin on the right hand side as viewed in the drawing. Thus when the switch is pulled up, the earthing  remains intact elsewhere, but the red/black 'swap places' on one  pickup only.

Oh, and finally (without wishing to sound  patronising folks):

Remember the Arched top type Les Paul requires a 3/8" length shaft to reach the top of the body, whereas others such as the flat topped S.Gs and Les Paul Studios etc. require only the oridinary 3/16" shaft length.

I hope this helps.

Regards,

Derek.  

   :D